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One Customer Experience: The Handshake Between Services and Product, by Chris O’Donnell, Hubspot

It wouldn’t have been about half the room, I think about half the room raise their hands. That’s really exciting! Hubspot! It’s a fascinating company, we’re about 11 years old and it’s a SAS company software-as-a-service with one of these more modern business models where we’re selling subscriptions it’s mostly low touch or inside sales driven, and then we have a big and very innovative service set of offerings.

On top of that, we’re about 2,000 people globally, most of us are in Cambridge, but we’re spread around the world. Singapore Sydney, Tokyo, Portsmouth, New Hampshire and a big office in Dublin 300 of those people are working on the product side. That’s my side of the house and about 700 are on the services side. We’ve done some really really interesting things to drive this growth. We went public about a couple of years ago.

We’ve had some good success and Patrick and Anne Thomas invited me out here to share some of those learnings. So we’ll take a look at a framework that is emerging of how we look at the handshake between product and services and also some background and some concrete takeaways. Some things that you guys can try at your organisations that may work for. You may foster a little bit better communication, tiny bit about me, I’m sort of an interesting person.

My background is in music, I got my degree in computers and music and from there I got into marketing. I was a marketer for a start-up for a while, and then I got into product management, because I was so passionate about the product side on what we were building and I’m really a maker at heart. Ever since I was very little, I wanted to play instruments and make things and do things and work with other creative people to build things.

I started some startups over the years. I came to HubSpot in an acquisition of a start-up about six years ago and I’m now leading the product development efforts. There. I get to live my passion with music by playing in a band outside of work and also contributing to Berklee online, which is Berklee School of Music’s fast-growing SAS offering, and I also spend a bunch of time over at MIT. Our company really was founded out of MIT, so we spend a lot of time with MIT in the community they’re talking about taking some of these scale-up innovation models across products, services, sales and so forth, and bringing them into larger organizations.

So that’s just a little bit about me. I have two wonderful kids. I live in the Boston area and I’m thrilled to be here. So why are we here? What’s the goal of this talk today, there’s a huge opportunity, a huge opportunity for teams like mine and teams like yours, to work better and to collaborate as we share these touch points in the customer journey. We’re going to talk about how we can get so focused on on-the-job in front of us that we forget to communicate effectively and we forget to align our purpose and our mission in our vectors across product development and service delivery of every kind.

So I’m going to show you just to start out sort of the summary and then we’re going to go back through the background, how we came to develop this and some concrete examples of what this looks like, hopefully with a couple of fun stories along the way You guys feeling good this morning, you psyched all right. Here’s the takeaway, the takeaway is everything starts with an agreement on who your target customers are.

If you have a service organization, delivering Enterprise Services and a product team that is still trying to build for an SMB you’re going to have a lot of problems right, we’ll talk about that, a unified mission for the company, giving these target customers what’s our approach, what Does success look like and what are the mantras that we’re repeating in the hallway from there? What does success look like and the key is not to have success in one silo and success in another silo, but to share those goals across marketing and sales? Let’s share those goals across products and services share those goals at the corporate level.

Beyond that we have paths for escalation. We love it when our frontline people can solve issues themselves across departments, but it’s not always possible. How do you build accountability and avoid having an adversarial relationship between these departments and then finally, wrapping that entire picture in a culture of regular and effective communication to really imple that change that we’re talking about? So that’s what we’re going to end up in this talk is this framework.

I want to start by reflecting on how I think about the evolution of collaboration at a technology company. It feels to me. Like the first place, there was real tension that forced a conversation about how should we be talking to each other? How should we be collaborating was between marketing and sales classic tension. We talk about it all the time at HubSpot, because we make marketing and sales software.

So we’ve learned over the years that communication about metrics on either side and sharing an overall service level agreement goal between marketing and sales can help deescalate that adversarial relationship and get everybody aligned and moving in the same direction. Beyond that, we have the relationship with sales and services, and I think a lot has been written about that. How do we effectively handoff a customer and onboard a customer? Deliver that technical implementation, whatever it is, that they’re expecting right after that sales process, which was hopefully delightful for them, and I would say, there’s been a lot of ink spilled on that as well.

Both of those we’ve really looked at as an industry, a lot – and you know I’ll be honest, I’m not sure too much has been spoken and written about the technology partner that you guys have in a product development team and how to dovetail those cultures and those Processes and force the right conversations across those groups, because that’s really, where there’s the massive opportunity to delight your customers, is absolutely by improving the service processes and organizations and offerings and all the rest of that, but using technology to make it easier.

Identifying customer roadblocks that service professionals may have to tiptoe around to find workarounds for and really improve the customer experience by getting at the root cause. And when I talk about product and services, it may be obvious to some, but just to err on the side of clarity and product. I’r talking about my entire world. This product managers, designers, UX people, analysts, product analysts and, of course, engineers, right and in product management.

We’re very keenly aware that, at the end of the day, it’s engineers with hands on keyboards that are really building the future of the company and addressing customer pain at its most root right. So we have a very respectful view of engineers and in our culture our job is to help them tackle the biggest problems and not tell them exactly how to tackle them, but to bring them the biggest problems, often from services.

So that joint is super important on the services side. I think really. The eight disciplines of TSIA are exactly what we’re talking about here. I don’t have them all listed, but for us at HubSpot it’s boy. We have a technical implementation team really important to sync with them as they onboard customers. We have a customer success, account management team and we have a big support team and that’s very important for us as well.

At HubSpot we’d love people to buy the software as low touch as possible, and then we would love them to have a hopefully free service experience. That’s as high touch as they want. So we have a huge investment in customer success and customer support. So a bit of a different model. That’s that’s pretty interesting! So if you, if you squint, you say well, this shouldn’t be too hard to set up. I mean we have services working with customers every day.

That’s all they do, and you have product that is not building the product for themselves. Product is building the product for customers as well, and so in the naive mind of an executive such as myself, I assume all the time that this is the ideal state and then, when customers are stuck and we’re spinning up additional service offerings and we’re doing all Of this all this kind of work to address issues that product knows about it and product is both helping deliver those services with tooling, with technology interfaces for the customer and also addressing some of those issues.

That should have never been there in the first place. But when I go and talk to the front lines on either side, I learned that’s that’s not always the case. It’s not always the case. Then account managers struggle to have their voice heard. What is the vocabulary for them to communicate the customer roadblocks that are so intuitive to them, the things that they see, customers struggle with on on a daily basis? You just walk across the street to engineering, and who do you talk to do you just grab an engineer, who’s who’s, pouring a coffee and you show them a screen shot of something frustrating.

Is it can be very difficult to figure out those paths now, at the end of the day, the opportunity is that product is building stuff and talking to customers and services is talking to customers constantly and would love to be involved in building stuff. How do we make that happen to have one unified customer experience? The key is really aligning and understanding what it looks like in that shared area and the actions you can take to widen that shared area and drive more collaboration between these two teams.

They share the goal, which is to reduce time to value for customers. Everybody wants customers to be successful to be happy to have high NPS. How do you get there? I used the word alignment and I’m going to talk a little bit more about alignment and I’ll back off the services piece and just talk about the most recent example of this. In my life, which, which I sort of have a fondness for doing the freshest example, we’re doing our strategic planning in product right now for 2018, and we have a process where we look at all of the great ideas that we want to do as a team.

We show the executive team, we show the company, we get some feedback from them and then internally we resource and we prioritize, and we do the things that you would imagine we would do last year. We did that and every one of those priorities was one team that was going to go. Do it and what we learned throughout the year was that that broke, because each of those teams is trying to deliver on their one thing, but they need help from everybody else.

So everybody’s trying to prioritize the dependencies that they have on other teams with their own goals. We did okay, we had a good year, but this year, what we’re doing is we are. We are deciding those priorities across all teams and then we’re going to break the work out and prioritize that work, raus teams and when we reflect on this, it’s a great example of a concept that we talk about constantly at HubSpot.

Now this is our co-founder Dharma shot and he got to spend some time with. Elon Musk was one of his heroes, one of my heroes as well, and he asked Elon what the key to scaling a company like HubSpot like Tesla, like SpaceX. What that key was – and he expected a big, long, structured diatribe on all the things you have to think about, and rather than that, Elon came back and said. Each person in your organization is a vector, I’m not a big physics person, but I’ve learned that a vector is a combination, two things, of course its directionality and momentum right, and so the interesting thing is, you can have two star players and giving you the short Version here, but you could have two star players who are trying to do opposite things, and the net of that is zero, whereas you can have a bunch of decent people all trying to do exactly the same thing.

They’re going to make great decisions they’re going to make great great progress, so my example about our product planning process was one to show that we had a very thoughtful process. I would argue that we have some really competent people who certainly care about the mission, but we sent them off in various different directions. So that’s that’s an example right of how we kind of align those vectors and get everybody multiplying each other’s work by heading in exactly the same direction.

What if we could do that with product and services, we don’t have it perfect. I can’t pretend that we have it perfect. I would say: we’ve made the most progress with our customer support team. I’r going to show you exactly what that looks like we have room to grow as sales. We have room to grow with customer success, we’re starting that the the early innings there. So I don’t. I don’t want to pretend like we have it all figured out, but we’re happy to share the learnings and where we are in that whole journey.

So, let’s review that framework step by step in a little bit more detail. If you remember the the the middle of that framework, the core was clear: target customers. It’s going to be impossible to do anything else and have alignment if different people in the business believe you are building for different customers and customers can be extremely different. Even with the same product at HubSpot, this is very true.

We have fortune 100 companies who use our product, and then we have five person companies whose our product and it’s exactly the same commercial off-the-shelf software. But we need to be mindful, as we build the software of that context, I’m going to give you a fun example. I read somewhere and and went and looked into it, and it’s actually totally true that if you buy whiskey and you buy it one of those little tiny containers at a time right, it’s a dollar, a piece and to make a bottle this size.

You need 14 of those, so that’s 14 dollars that bottle cost $ 26 and 99 cents for the exact same product. The exact same amount think about that for a second totally different buyers, complete and totally different purpose. Somebody wants to have it on their shelf forever. Somebody just wants one little quick drink whatever it is. You have very, very different buyers, so you have the same product and you package it in a way where people are very aware of who the target customer is what this looks like at HubSpot.

Is this idea of a core buyer persona? We’ve evolved them over time and everybody in the company becomes intimately familiar with what that target customer looks like we had a big debate early on probably five years into the business right right around the time that I came between a persona that was then named owner. Ollie in a persona who was named marketing merit now an owner ollie was somebody who didn’t have a marketing team who was buying our marketing software to use themselves for their their car wash or their drywall company or whatever it may be, and then marketing meri was A very different persona, who was a full time marketer, but was very overworked, so the profile of that company.

The context in the person was using that product was very different and what we did was we looked at what we think of as the unit economics and SAS right so in in SAS. We’re, of course, obvious overwhelmingly concerned with the cost to acquire customer and the lifetime value of that customer. How long it takes to recoup that initial cost to acquire the customer and what we found was the unit economics between these two personas were totally different.

For the same product, they were totally different that allowed us, as a company to say we’re going to focus on one we’re going to focus on Mary, because that’s a better strategic bet for our company. Now, to this day, you can walk through the hallways and ask anybody what an owner ollie is and you’re going to get exactly the same answer and we’re updating these right. So now we have new personas. We felt that our customers had outgrown those personas.

So we have marketing Michelle and growth Gary, and you can ask anybody in the company to explain the difference between these two, what kinds of companies they work at what’s important to them, how do they buy? What do they expect in the service experience? What’s their level of technical knowledge in onboarding all of this kind of stuff and everybody in the company is going to be able to give you a pretty consistent answer right so you’re, starting to see that a language can emerge where all of a sudden and the Count manager can say to me, hey, I have I have this company in there they’re trying to get started in it’s a classic, Michele great fit.

Okay, that’s going to speak to product a lot more than hey here’s. A huge deal we signed write help me make. My commission is a very different message: it’s much more of a strategic mindset for the business, much more of a customer and business first way of thinking about it now beyond that beyond the customers. Let’s think about the mission, so you have those customers. What is the mantra that you’re going to use to service those folks and sell them and onboard them? What is your, what is your North Star? Google is famous for having the the mission of organizing all of the world’s information, so if you’re an engineer or a product manager or a salesperson, you know that that’s where the company is going, it’s going to get all the world’s information and organize it to be Available to everybody or Dropbox have all your stuff everywhere.

You go very, very clear mission at HubSpot. Our mission is to transform how companies grow so there’s an emphasis there on this idea of economic opportunity. People are coming to us to find further growth in their business. One and to transform we’re not trying to help them, do what they’ve been doing that got them this far we’re trying to change the way that they market and sell to match the way that humans have changed the way that they shop and buy again.

This is just mantra to us. You can ask anybody in the company what that mission is and how it ties to their day to day, and it’s very clear, another great pathway for services to be communicating with product. The next layer from there is sharing goals, language and metrics in pretty much every culture. You have your KPIs, you have maybe your waterfalls and your goals and what over performance looks like or OKR whatever framework it is that you’re, using one thing that we’ve learned is that we run into a lot of trouble when we expect teams to work together across Disciplines and leave them with disparate goals, the more that we can take two leaders, two vice presidents across marketing and product, let’s say, or services and product services and marketing whatever it is and say: here’s your North Star together, you share this together, the more the front Line people magnetized into that and move forward in a really effective way.

We’ve decided as a company that the most important number for us is Net Promoter Score and with which I’m sure you’re all very familiar, and the interesting thing that we’ve done here is we’ve taken. A high-level brand and sort of customer level NTS metric of how likely are you to recommend HubSpot to a friend or colleague and we’ve, given the ownership of that to product right. It’s a really really hard number to move that forces a few things.

It forces us and products to get to the root cause of issues. Ah, so now, when we hear from services that customers are frustrated, it’s harder for us to put our blinders on and build the next feature, we’re so excited, because what we really want to do is delight the customers more so than to build that next feature and Get to market and compete a little bit harder in the market. This is a strategic corporate level priority that is shared across all the teams.

It also forces product to get out of our silo and out of our out of our seeds. Quite quite literally, and not just to talk to customers, but to talk to the people in service again customer success and technical technical implementation Academy, which is our education initiative and to hear from them and really digest and really listen to the feedback that they’re giving us. Because it’s key for us to address, as we move NPS again breaking down walls with shared goals in paths for escalation.

You know boy. I’ve heard it said that the measure of an organization, the measure of an organization is how effectively frontline people across departments can solve issues without taking it to their bosses. You know you have organizations where two people on the frontlines can just deal with an issue on a good day. We’ll have a support. Rep, take a call, identify a software defect, find the product manager find the find the engineer, maybe and within minutes, deploy a solution right and we do we do pretty well with that.

We don’t do perfectly with that. I’r going to show you examples of us not doing perfectly, but we have a culture where we want to be able to take that input and fix it in real time for our customers. We’re a three billion dollar public company, we’re a SAS company and we still go to production 500 times a day right from our engineers. Our engineers have full autonomy to fix issues and ship features 500 times a day.

It’s very important right so that input from services is absolutely key there. So one of the things that we do is we just start to look. We just. We have a phrase that we call sunlight where you have the opportunity to build a process out. You have an opportunity to build in checks and balances and introduce red tape and down in the business. One option you have is to not add the processes, not add the sign-offs and all that, but to provide sunlight.

You know a funny way you could do. This is, you could take expense reporting and you could say you know what use good judgment on an expense reporting, but we’re going to stack rank, how much everybody is spending on travel and if you decide to do something with travel, that’s irresponsible everybody’s going to see It and make funny. You know it’s just a hypothetical example, but um it actually works.

It’s like first-class to Australia. You know really, but it’s a long flight and we we cut them some slack. So here’s one where we say look. We haven’t so Giro’s our issues. Right I’ve got a bunch of yous Jared. We used your love at last, seen by the way, they’re doing really really cool things. If we look up to a company in the market, that has a really innovative go to market model, it’s at lassie and we love their products and we love them.

J Simon’s their Presidents on our board and they just had an unbelievable earnings call by the way, which I recommend you guys review, is really really cool. What they’re doing with service and with sales and rnd really driving a lot of this alignment and boy big results. In the markets, so we have these issues, we have about 8 % of the calls we get and support get escalated formally into product as as a JIRA as an issue, some sort of help, ticket or debug or defect that they’ve found.

You know what we can do is sit down together and just look at how many of these are getting either responded to or resolved later than we would expect, and let’s look at that by team, and it’s not something that we need to send around to everybody And we it’s not something that we need. You know an action plan against and, and you know, full accountability, but what it does is, if you, if you get people from all these disciplines, into a room together to look at it and just have a conversation about it, it starts to foster a lot of Trust we’ve learned that when we don’t actively communicate with services and when services doesn’t demand a forum with us, we just assume that everything is okay or services assumes that there’s no path for them.

To talk to us so again light reports where it’s just a fact on how we’re doing together in terms of communicating and getting the people in the room together, and I think that if you get the right people in the room and often that’s not executives, often That’s line managers right get line. Managers in the room from these different disciplines give them some privacy and say what the heck is going on.

You know you guys, you guys figure it out and go well. You know not for nothing. We don’t have a lot of Engineers on that or we’re not used to hiring people who are really good at solving the types of problems that we have and we’ll talk more about that. But this has been really very cool for us without again creating an adversarial relationship. Here’s another one for for Gira’s, just time to respond right, like how many of these tickets are we getting.

How is time to response going and we do look at these at the at the corporate level? We look at these at what we call helm, which is our executive team, and it’s just it’s good to know that we care, you know just show us in product. Getting up and showing this chart just sends the message that, yes, we get it. We care and customers deserve an answer and deserve to close the loop when they have a question about the the product functioning properly very cool stuff, very straightforward by the way, not rocket science.

It’s really the human side that matters and then wrapping this all in not just regular communication but effective communication. I’ll give you an example. This is if this applies to your organization, particularly if you work in customer support technical support of some kind. This was a huge breakthrough for us for a long time. We would get incident rate, so our support team would, on a monthly basis, quarterly basis, say here’s why people are calling in right and we would try to address those by number of cases.

The bully was really hard and some of those you know how would talk to our head of services and say: okay, we’ll try to get rid of all those and he goes whoa hi. My hypothesis is people who call in about that end up being really happy. Customers, because we get them on the phone and give them a great experience, we set them up. We explain the mental model for them. We do some education and then they’re happy for years, okay, so, okay, so we don’t want to lose those tickets, so it actually became not about the the specific reason that they were calling in.

It was something much more new us. We have this great program at HubSpot, called the accelerated leadership program where we hire folks out of business school and we give them rotations in different departments six months at a time, and then they end up leading a team in a department that was a great fit For them, by the way, this program has worked out, super super well and in a world where it’s tough to find you know, line managers and director level folks.

This is a great way to build those kinds of roles and find people who excel in them across disciplines. So with this fella did he took six months and he said there’s a lot more than just incident cake incident rate. How happy are people once they get off the phone? How long is the call? How often did they repeat and call back in on the same question and he came to present in our product managers meeting and it was this beautiful three-dimensional view of the customer experience that we just couldn’t ignore.

You know I mean this was really interesting and it was a level of thoughtfulness that he put in. He came in, he very very graciously said you know, I’ve thought a lot about this and I’ve talked to a lot of customers, and you know I’m going to take a I’m going to take a whack at what a score might mean across all of these things And nobody picked apart, while you’re multiplying this by three and multiplying this by two and weighting it this way and weighting it that way, nobody had the energy to pick it apart, because you know what it was good enough and it was very thoughtful, and so my Advice to any department trying to work with product is I point to this example and say you know, imagine owning the products and having the the empathy in the connection with someone.

Who’s really thought, through the experience of servicing, that customer in a robust way in a detailed way and offered this level of insight to the product team. This thing comes out, we publish it in slack and we have all the product managers in there and it is just a firestorm of commentary. You know, and it’s not pointing fingers, it’s people acknowledging that they know that certain things are issues or acknowledging that there is a minor outage over here or something happened over there with a third party API, and so there’s this awareness that just bubbles up around it.

That is super healthy and now we’re trying to do the same with customer success. It’s a little bit newer, but what we’re doing is basically a leader on our customer success. Team is saying: okay, when we do calls with customers and we try to get them set up or on board a new point of contact or worker renewal or whatever. It is we’re going to hear the roadblocks that they have in the product and we’re going to enter them in to the CRM and report on those and start to fold those back into that same heat map.

It’s it’s a newer view for us and it’s a newer relationship, but it’s very very promising and it’s working really well and again: it’s you can’t really argue with it. If you’re in product, you gets very and here’s the dirty little secret, a product manager. In my experience is you know they have one answer to anything, you say: hey. Could we go do this? Could we add this feature? Could we do this and they only have one answer which is: maybe you know, and we teach them to do that? That’s like actually the trade for all sorts of reasons, but the real unit.

The real reason is, as a product manager, you’re selling things to engineers. You are a salesperson of ideas to engineers. You know engineers, no matter what they say, they’re working on or anything they can always come in and say. Well I have this urgent thing. I need to work on before I get to the thing that you want me to do in my experience that can be 90 days of working on this thing before they get to the thing I want to do, and so you know, I’ve learned primary source material Is so so important for working with designers and developers, you can almost leave the source material.

These are the things that are causing the most pain for the customer. I did that once with a very skeptical tech lead – and I just said, hear hear the tie was way back when we first had some this information. I said here the top ten issues that cause people to call into support and he read them. He said three of these are on my team. I said this has been good, it’s a good talk, you know and he got so fired up to go address those, as opposed to me, coming with a list of things that I thought would solve those problems.

Without that context, right without that that primary source material, so primary source material from services helps PM’s, but it also helps the engineers wrap their heads around the issues and I’m going to wrap up here and say: we’ve seen a bunch of charts. You know we’ve seen frameworks, we’ve seen graphics, it’s not about that. It’s about people. This was a meeting I was in Monday, and here we have our head of engineering.

We have frontline service people from different departments. We have a product manager, that’s Bella in the bottom left hand, corner she’s, explaining all of the context around the issue. She’s letting services understand know that she understands the issue and a from her perspective on what they’re doing to address it and so forth. This is a great meeting. This is a killer meeting. This has completely changed the relationship between these two groups and we don’t have to get you know a thousand people in a room together to review this data.

We can get six people again. It’s a combination of more senior people and frontline people who really have the context so listen. I hope this has been useful, enjoy the rest of the day, connect with me if you’d like to continue the conversation and more than anything, thank you guys so much


 

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B2B Procurement Market Overview By Brady Behrman, CEO, PunchOut2Go from Distribution Summit 2019

He actually has a proven track record as an entrepreneur. Wait, your turn all right. You can come up, but he’s done all sort of stuff building all these tech technology, businesses that focus on client success, innovation, you wouldn’t know it to look at him, but he helps organizations of all sizes just adapt to you know the technology is changing and all The different things that are evolving welcome be co-founder, I’m sorry founding partner and CEO, a punch-out to go one of our gold sponsors Brady Berman.

Thank you test, test test, guys, hear me: okay, all right! Thank you all right how we doing b2b conference, if you’re here for a b2b conference, stand up if you’re here for a b2b conference stand up. If you’re here for a b2b conference stand up, I must be at the wrong place. Come on come on, come on! Come on this is I’m the last one you like I put up with me. For I don’t know three hours, it’s going to be worth every minute, all right, everybody standing up! That’s nice ever put your right foot out, put your right foot in and just shake it all about.

You do the Hokey Pokey! You turn yourself around and that’s what it’s all about right, I’ll feel a little better. You don’t look, really excited I’m going to get. You excited soon, all right learning a lot right. I’ve taken a couple notes. I feel very honored to be here with you today. We’ve traveled from the long distant area of Virginia this morning brought some team members who have probably hand at one of these to each one of you right.

Everybody got one. If you don’t, please put your hand up so there’s a couple of trends that I think that we’re all noticing you have a couple of different, distinct blogs. You have your direct-to-consumer. Perhaps you have your direct b2b right. Just to kind of comment be to be. You know, organizations that find a part need it. No real relationship, and now you have your relationship driven b2b, blog right, the relationship driven, b2b blog becomes more complex.

You may need to have approvals and different mechanisms on your e-commerce application that provide the means. For the end, users, within an organization to add items to the cart but ultimately have a layer of approval right and then there’s another one, there’s this eprocurement blog. If any of you have heard of a procurement, see a couple head-shaking, he procurement happens all around us. It’s really wild every plate in this building actually came through our system.

We didn’t sell it. We just worked for the company that sells to all the Hilton’s Hilton, for instance, uses a platform called Bourke Street when they want to purchase goods and services. They use bird street Hilton, all the brands use it and the same thing holds true and really any organization, so the e-procurement sector is a massive opportunity for you, and I want to educate you on it now all right, everybody feeling better.

We need to do hokey-pokey again, so the fastest-growing b2b blog is e-procurement 37 % growth per year. It’s insane and we’ll talk a little bit more about this. Our agenda is going to be. If you can keep up with me, walking back and forth. I apologize our agenda is uh. What is the procurement, the e-procurement market overview, how destructor abuse l within procurement? What is the punch out? It’s not a article game punch out to go overview, a live action, kind of demonstration.

It’s not really going to be live. I got some screenshots to show you, though, and then we’ll have some Q & A right and then we’ll be closer to cocktail hour, sound good, all right. So, let’s start off with you know. What is the procurement? I gave you a little scenario of the Hilton, so any procurement systems are widely leveraged by organizations around the world. These eprocurement systems provide the great means for organizations to automate the procure-to-pay process.

Increase visibility into the organization spend increase contract compliance, connect and drive, spend to preferred suppliers achieve proper approvals, bla bla, bla, bla, bla, ultimately transacting with suppliers that are allowed to be transacted with across an organization. I’r not here to sell you on any procurement system at all. I’r not here to sell you on anything, I’m trying to educate you help.

You understand why these platforms are used, why they exist and why more organizations around the world are using these systems. So if we look at the landscape ten years ago, so actually let me back up a little bit 20 years ago, when I was seven years old, I started a web development and marketing company to build a lot of commerce applications for b2c and b2b. As I’ve been deeply entrenched, since I was seven ten years ago, when I was seventeen, one of our customers was a small hardware company in in Richmond Virginia, their largest customer was a state of Virginia State.

Virginia told this customer told our customer company called Harper Hardware. You either need to be able to integrate with our procurement system, which is called Arriba, so we’re not going to be able to do business with you we’re going to go to Grainger, there’s somebody else. We value the relationship with you, but you have to do this. So we went out and did this integration for them and lost our butts.

I was talking somebody else about yeah, there’s about some time to get ahead in life. Did the integration took us about six months? It was brutal and I like things that are brutal right. So I continued to do more brutal integrations, but back then all we really had was like a RIBA. An Oracle which is I procurement, is what the procurement components called. Everybody knows s ap the actual procurement components called SRM supplier relationship manager, PeopleSoft Oracle, product and then comes along like Koopa and Jagger.

There are literally hundreds of e procurement systems being used around the world today. Now we’re supporting organizations in 45 countries and have connected. I think to a hundred and cost 160 different procurement systems. What’s really important about this. This slide here is based upon the customers that you’re selling to some of these providers that you see on this on this plethora of NASCAR slide deck of evolution of e procurement systems.

Many of them are niche providers. Like I mentioned bird Street, I’m not even sure if they’re on there focuses on hospitality, Jagger was formerly called syquest focused on higher education. Esm used to be called east school mall focused on on k12, so what’s happening is that more and more organism or more procurement systems are coming to market, usually in a niche focused areas right because in business it’s usually nice to be able to be in some Form of a niche right, but then they get bigger and they broaden their horizons and they change their name, but these are very important things to think about.

So if one of your customers says hey, we have this arriba thing. Oh, I know what that is, that goofball of it that b2b conference told me all about it right if somebody mentions Jagger well now you know it’s probably you know higher ed. Maybe it’s you know the Ohio State or whatever the case may be a lot of e-procurement systems out there and they’re growing rapidly. We see new e-procurement systems, it feels like daily, so the b2b procurement market overview so actually related to procurement.

So 50 % of companies already leverage some form of procurement system. They may not leverage it well, but they’re getting their start to get better 33 % plan to implement a procurement technologies. It’s happened again all around us. Nobody really knows about it, but it’s about understanding your customers right. This is just another blog right. You have your direct b2b, you have your may be targeted Facebook, social media campaigns for your direct customers, and now you have this other blog of e-procurement right and it’s a very important one to pay attention to, because it’s only growing right.

The b2b train has left the station was a cool thing. I heard the other day. It’s pretty good way, if you think about it right, so the time is now to start understanding this landscape right. So these light ride to put a lot of words up here, because I feel like that, maybe confuses people more and maybe look a little better. I was clean now, so the most useful features are these customized product and price of display.

So these eprocurement systems are glorified marketplaces for an organization right. The load product data into these II procurement systems they’ll be able to access vendors through various means, but we’ll talk about a few minutes. Do all the kind of sourcing and compliance all the cool stuff. Have you guys ever provided like an excel sheet to your customers for them to load into there? I got one laughing over here.

It’s fun right, yeah! So that’s just one of the things so and and and make a note of that. The customers today that you are providing those excel sheets of data to write those down because there’s become your first targets, but ultimately the e-procurement is going to be growing. We all know this number X, se was nine trillion this morning, ten trillion six trillion two trillion. Three trillion six point: seven trillion bifrost and so whatever it’s growing way faster than b2c right and it’s a great opportunity.

I was talking to a gentleman earlier if you think about b2b and b2c right b2c 10 year 20 years ago. Again, when I was 7 was a different world right, but today you’re facing the same challenges you’re facing the same challenges that you that organizations face 20 years ago in a different environment right b2b is a much more complex space, many more blogs, but the markets going To continue to grow so I’ll, give you these silly crazy numbers.

So these marketplaces again, I’m going to show you sample of one here in a minute. There’s two general ways that you as a distributor or a seller in our world. We call it can provide your customers with products hosted catalogues. These are excel sheets. Ariba is one of the larger players, so they and they call they’re, hosted catalogs sip catalogs CIF. Anybody ever heard of one of those again they’re, not fun.

So these are again kind of static files. Nothing real-time about it. You’re here to do more with your b2b commerce application, static files do nothing for you. They do provide some value to your customers because it gets your products in their marketplace right. Sometimes you do a little bit of both have kind of hosted and punchouts, but the static file business is not a fun business that most organizations are getting away from that because it’s it’s a dependency on them to manage the content as well as you, and it’s Not an interest experience right, it’s you may have all this beautiful data right.

We’ve talked about enrichment of data right, utilizing your data automating with pins and all this cool stuff right and then you go to a hosted catalog and it’s five columns of data and then a strip out two of them and they’ll have two carbons right. It’s not a good experience, so, with punch out catalogs punch out catalogs allow these organizations that are leveraging these eprocurement systems like Arriba and Koopa, to access your actual ecommerce application.

They become on single click within an applicant within these procurement systems. They get authenticated from that system directly into your e-commerce system right. So now, if you have cloris right, if you have all that real-time, this of inventory and pricing availability offering the whole nine yards, it’s no longer a static process. It’s a living! Breathing commerce component! That’s now entrenched within your buyers, a procurement system right it has that dynamic, the real timeless of things, the ability to have configurable types of products.

You may have specific types of bundles. You provide some of your customers and then you have your other abilities like upselling and cross-selling, and you know all the great things that you have again talking about: the enrichment of data, the MSDS files, the user guides all the relevant information. All the things that you guys are working really hard to do to differentiate yourselves from competitors.

You can make that available to your customers through these procurement blogs, with a hosted catalog again. It’s it’s aggregating product data from all types of different approved vendors within a procurement world, and it becomes this very static, terrible-looking situation, where, with punch out it’s it’s them actually authenticating and using your e-commerce application that you are investing in right – and this is just it Again, another little blog that you need to be aware of so the actual punch out process.

I talked about a moment ago again, the users logs into the procurement system right they can access vendors through various ways in different procurement systems. But ultimately, you end up with some real estate I’ll show you what that looks like in a minute on single click. The user gets authenticated again into your e-commerce application. You probably have customers that get different pricing and offering right.

I think Tom you mentioned you have a thousand products you’re going to add, maybe ten thousand more or something you probably have different customers that may only purchase three hundred products at these particular prices. Another customer purchases 2,700 products right so using your e-commerce infrastructure. Again, if you have there’s real-time hooks with cloris or whatever your integration is between your ERP and your commerce, application, which is a no-brainer by the way it looks really cool.

He didn’t pay me to say that use it right, but ultimately a user gets to the e-commerce application, they’re building a car, they’re doing cool stuff they’re doing a lot of chat. I can’t find his product. I think there was you earlier right right, I’ll show you something a minute. You know they’re, building a cart, they’re doing everything I do. They were looking at their order. History, they’re picking up a quote.

You all have to have quotes Tom. Put that on your roadmap. Got to get quotes up. They’re, quoting is a big big thing, because you want to utilize the commerce experience drive. Sales through commerce doesn’t have to be outside of the world. Ultimately, they add items to their cart all right once they get to the shopping, cart. Page they’re not proceeding through our normal checkout they’re, going to band in the cart crazy right, they’re, going to transfer that car back into their procurement system right goes back as a requisition.

Once it gets approved, that’s what a purchase order gets then right now you got the deal. You could do the work you get paid. Everybody’s happy automate it right. How many of you are getting orders with junk SKUs? You ever get orders junk SKUs. Just one. Are you the only one getting orders enrichment of data, utilizing the data right? No more junk orders we all like orders right, but if you get an order with a junk SKU for $ 65 and a cost, your company’s $ 65 to process an order? Well, you haven’t really yielded anything right, so enrichment of data, all right so enhancing business values to punch out, gives you exact sis to your customers.

Access to the latest products and product information from your catalog take advantage of contract compliant pricing order, build those configurable products right we have. I was telling somebody we have a customer that has 66 billion products. I forgot how many zeros it’s a lot. I don’t know it’s like the hardest products that configure its nuts and bolts, and it shouldn’t be that hard. I wouldn’t think, but I guess it’s pretty hard, but it you know you have to be a major engineer, but ultimately these configurable elements are very important to many of your businesses, easily again kind of create, there’s requisitions and streamline the purchasing right.

How we streamlining the purchasing, we got good data right, you’re, getting orders with good data because they derived from your commerce experience in real time, dry, purchasing compliance to and control spending across the organization across their organization. It’s a win for you as well, because again you’re getting good data you’re, getting orders all right. This is on that document. So I’ll spare you this keep that.

So again, when I was 17 years old and we did our first punch-out integration, we realized that needed to be an easier way right. We came up with this far-fetched idea. That’s today is supporting tens of thousands of integration points around the world of this adaptable technology. This kind of paypal of the b2b II procurement space, this solution that could be leveraged by companies of all types using any type of infrastructure.

They want we’re very much agnostic right. So that’s how we go to market we’re able to work with Sachin at big commerce right DC cap with any of the platforms are using, and this is important, because Commerce is an evolutionary process right. What you can afford today, or can do today, may be vastly different a year two or three down the road. Continuity is a big important piece of what we do at punch-out to go by being able to support our customers and bring value to helping them leverage.

Whatever best in breed commerce technologies, they have right here, they’re leveraging. This is our nascar slide deck and it’s not a bragging deck. The sheer volume of the nuances that you guys have imagine the nuances that all these other companies have. This crazy nuances and many of these companies are at the elementary stage of understanding this eat procurement space as well, but again, it’s the fastest growing b2b blog that there is this e-procurement space.

Every company has their own different commerce technologies right. So Lowe’s is a homegrown system, moving to a hybrid WebSphere model and other zones. I think Oracle. Something and worth is Magento and you know there’s a big commerce up there, there’s all types of stuff again helping companies leverage whatever they want. These integrations are nice. Is anybody ever done an EDI integration, you undo two more right yeah.

What if you wanted to do? One more that’d be pretty cool right. So that’s what I this, this landscape, that we work in it’s very complex, so a lot of different procurement systems that I mentioned, I think a hundred fifty or sixty that we connect to today. They all use standards right EDI is a standard C XML. Another standard buzzword – they all use them on standardized and, what’s worse, is each system that supports that standard of C XML and enforces as a standard.

The actual buying organization on those procurement system has their own unique requirements right. So you end up with a lot of kind of bespoke integrations and this diagram does it. It gets purely chaotic, but we come in and we paint this pretty picture and we deliver on the ability that we can connect your commerce technologies. Your commerce technologies me and your big commerce, your Magento, whatever you’re, using right to your customers on any procurement system, no matter what it may be, any we do that very well.

We actually never lost a customer. I’r pretty excited about that. That’s cuz! I talked to that talk, um and dad I’m just kidding so benefit to be procurement. I think you know this is a really important is for your customers. It’s enhancing the shopping experience. It’s streamlining the order process reducing the cycle times. Lowering procurement cost increasing order, accuracy, invoicing, automation, all these cool things right.

You want to do the same, so that’s a win for you as well you’re going to expand your sales reach. I guarantee it or I’ll, buy you a beer for Mom or Oh drink product pricing availability, it’s a very sticky blog and all these years of doing these integrations. Since we were so seventeen, I could probably count on two hands. How many integrations got turned off and it was probably due to some type of acquisition or something it’s a very sticky blog now, once you’re in there you’re you’re pretty much in there, unless you wouldn’t really screw it up, and it’s a relationship blog right.

I always say it’s a good old boy or good old girl Network right. It really is it’s. The relationships are really important. All right, so I was going to do a live demo, but I didn’t have the ability, so I grabbed some screenshots. So this is a procurement system called Koopa they’re, probably the fastest-growing procurement system on the market. It’s used by, like Tesla, is going commerce with Tesla’s or sales forces or vc8 animal hospitals or all across the map.

Airbus whatever. So this is VCA. Vca is a large animal hospital group. I think they have 800 locations in North America, they bought Koopa and they actually just like we kind of do for suppliers. We do for buyers as well, so they bought Koopa and they put punch-out to go between Koopa and all of their key vendors. I think ninety-four percent of their spend is going through technology so of those 800 locations.

When anytime, anybody needs to buy anything, they must go to Koopa. They can’t just get in their car and go to Lowe’s and go to Staples they. They have to use these systems it’s the way it works. So what do we see here? It’s it’s! It’s a marketplace: it’s it’s their internal purchasing engine. This is these procurement systems are bolt ons to larger erps like an S, AP, ERP or Oracle. Whatever the case may be, in this case, they’re homegrown, but ultimately it’s a bolt on and it just does a better job of everything vendor related.

You are a vendor, the distributor seller right, I know so. I just grew up the words here. It’s amazing, you go to certain places and you guys say bars and this things – and you know everybody’s in different world, but I think you guys are all distributors, but in our world you’re sellers or the vendor right. So, within these procurement systems the end user, if they want to buy anything, they have to go through here.

So it says: what do you need? It’s pretty cool good, a little opening right. So I need gloves, that’s cool. So all this is fed. What you’re, seeing here in this internal market place by hosted catalog files? This is not the experience right. It’s not the e-commerce experience, there’s often a very healthy mix of hosted catalogs and these kind of punch out catalogs. But what we see here is this right.

So can anybody point out anything that’s wrong like there’s like that’s not like today’s world of Commerce, like anybody see anything silly about this experience, I’ll give you a hint sighs all right like there’s, no configurable elements right, it’s antiquated there’s! Maybe there needs to be an MSDS on this or a user guide. Here’s how you put the glove on. I don’t know it can’t exist right so with punch out over here on the right hand, side we have shop online.

These are their punch out vendors. These are the vendors that they use punch out with again on single click, an end user can access any one of these vendors through punch off. So I am going to magically select CDW boom. That’s cool right! What’s that we do it again, mmm all right! So now we are authenticated into the CDW application. There’s my guy! That’s my Account Manager, hey Glen. I got a question for you right so now I see that they have quotes again really important or I can shop right.

So you know HP workstation, it’s not configurable, but that’s. Ok. What do we have here, but we don’t have that static? Look. We don’t have that cheesy whatever and we got Glenn down here on the left-hand corner. Saying hey I’m here to help you write your chat. Cdw the Grainger’s right, I think you heard the statistic earlier: who was it that said eighty percent or something was it great? These companies have just crushed this eprocurement space.

It’s been a huge blog for them right and it’s and that’s why they come up with that number and it’s a different type of dynamic right. You same thing like with the thermo Fisher or some of these other kind of marketplace types of concepts. They go after these procurement blogs. It’s it’s not a reactive blog like if I talked earlier remember about my hardware company in Richmond Virginia. They were reactive right, we’re finding more companies now starting to get more proactive right.

So these companies like this, have been very much proactive, which is why they’ve seen so much growth and b2b right the same thing that Amazon is trying to do, but ultimately we’re on this e-commerce site. It’s a much more enriched experience underneath there’s way more pictures, we’re not limited to one picture. Somebody else talked about get good pictures on your websites. Obviously very important.

Don’t use a cookie cutter product data, you have enriched the product data, but it creates a good experience and then you can have the little. You know the HP expert guy there to talk to. I think his name was Glenn. I don’t know, but ultimately we can add the item to our cart and again, the biggest difference is: is that we’re not proceeding through our normal checkout right? What we can do, maybe I remember we’re going to carry that shopping.

Cart back over the procurement system right. Why is that? We got ta, take it through approvals right, so now we transferred it back. Just like that BAM I didn’t have to click as thought about is, like my Alexa Alexa flip, the page um, but now so we plugged in you know where. So all the ship twos right 800 locations – I mentioned they all live in the procurement system. This is now and it’s it seems weird, because the users now had it items to the cart.

They brought it back now, they’re going to tell you where they want it, which seems weird right, but this is how the process works. So I’ve decided I want to send it to Cincinnati Ohio. I can look at this beautiful data right. It’s not junk data. It’s clean data and then, ultimately I can submit it for approval now. I can also go and shop from other vendors as well. I can go and punch out the staples and add some staples.

I can go punch out to err gas and add some helium for tonight’s party or whatever the case may be, but ultimately I could submit it for approval right, which will send the purchase orders out to the various vendors for them to be able to then fulfill. All right and buy pizzas for the office right, good stuff, so how’s this little pointer work. This is tricky. I’r screwed push a button, alright cool, so mmm b2b storefront right, that’s your Magento’s, whatever, whatever use them for commerce, big commerce, Oh ERP! This is your ERP.

On the right hand, side right whatever that may be p21, whatever the case may be, that automation is really important right for pushing up product and pricing and all that good stuff. But, more importantly, when you get orders right. So, even though, in in the e-procurement space, everything is derived from external applications, it still could be driven through the commerce blog, and this is really becoming even more important for large companies.

I was, I was up in Philly talking to one of the largest medical device companies in the world and they want to make sure that they can even get EDI orders back through commerce. Edi has been seen as this kind of siloed world, but it’s really a commerce, it’s really commerce technology, so you can drive more through commerce. You mentioned, I think, ten percent of your businesses through commerce. Do you have any EDI? No it’s, but if you did it probably wouldn’t be part of that ten percent right.

You wouldn’t think about it that way, but it really should be going through commerce, so that need to go over direct, your ERP, who else was doing EDI? Are you guys running that through commerce or just directly, to your ERP yeah, so you lose some visibility? You don’t really know where that’s that’s that, where you guys are probably all kind of commerce professionals in your organization, your measured about your measured for what you accomplished to commerce right.

You might look at this about trying to receive orders and so forth and transact through commerce, rather than directly with your ERP, especially if your commerce component is connected to your ERP right becomes more modular right, which is important so that the workflow was is the top Left is we started at Koopa, we clicked on CDW, with through Alexa right, no just kidding click through CDW. We got authenticated to the store right, CDW’s application, we’re serving up the product and pricing for VCA.

In that scenario, we added that HP product right. If we had a question, we could talk to Glenn that was cool in the live chat. We transferred that cart back over to Koopa. On the left hand, side right again, we can go shop for helium. We can do whatever we want, but ultimately again submit for Peter for the PIO and get approval and then that pio gets sent back and that completes the status. So it’s not an abandoned cart.

Maybe it’s like a pending cart or something of that nature. Anybody any questions of this kind of workflow like will we just step through just make any sense? Does anybody have any advice for me to give anybody some type of elevator speech next time, I’m in the elevator? What do you do? I work on a computer huh tall building yeah exactly right. If anybody has any advice on that, I don’t really love to hear it alright.

So what kind of questions do we have? It’s is your mind. Blown here is uh. You guys feeling all right yeah. Well again, so only approved vendors are made accessible, yeah, so we’re logged in as P odigo, that’s our little acronym and then we clicked on CDW and that click we’re all we’re kind of through the browser you know i’ll fennec ate it in the VCAs b2b account Right so there’s like a handshake between punch out to go and CDW says: hey welcome, VCI in your application.

Yes, sir, I would shop what percentage do you think of b2b commerce is going through eprocurement right now and where’s that headed yeah? I got that data. Oh Mexican, right here I was just looking at the report and just came out. I think it’s a 10 percent, so they said so. This is a b2b online. They put out a report. Ten percent on supplier website growth, but I think it’s it’s 37 percent growth across the e-procurement Channel.

It’s it’s very tricky right, so you know for Grainger it might be 50 percent of their business. Remember, 50 percent of companies are using e-procurement systems. They may not be using them well, but it’s going to vary it’s going to vary based on you know your relationship, you have with the customer, and you know they’re kind of the volume right now is coffee procurement, a large percentage yeah.

Let me get to be good one second yeah, so this was mapping out the 10 million dollar number and to attend trillion-dollar number, I’m sorry. So in of the 10 trillion and employees on supplier websites again related to be to be kind of the suppliers, you know the employees of an organization, 954 billion SAS eprocurement systems outside of a network, 834 billion, a procurement of services outside of a net 185 billion.

So it’s over a trillion through procurement. The the weird thing about the report, though it is, is that it segments EDI networks where, in essence, a lot of these like Arriba’s and different platforms are also EDI networks. Edi networks can consist of four point. Seven trillion of the ten trillion dollar number and 218 billion was handled at travel and strip clubs, but it’s really going to vary, but this this article is actually really well well done.

It’s is on b2b e-commerce, world digital commerce, 360. They do a good job of covering b2b good question. Yes, sir, if I’m ear gas and I want to be part of the VCA yeah. What’s what does that relationship? Look like how do how does air gas go about being one of those logos, yeah so they’re in a pretty good position, because then I really have kind of one competitor right, so they have the relationship.

This space again is good old boy, girl, girl network, its relationship driven. You have to win the loyalty, the love when they evaluate your capabilities, as you know, for commerce right, I think when you, when you start looking at landing a larger accounts, you’re going to go through this RFP process. It’s going to ask you if you’re capable of doing these particular types of things right so for air gas, they already have the relationship, but they have to have the relationship you can’t just go enter on into a network right.

You have to have a relationship or find a way to one of those relationships and they may start through our of pees right with organizations or Mississippi Valley, municipalities or organization. You know, like VCAs of the world that you might sell to, and maybe just maybe BCAAs your customer and maybe only for the store, so somehow our buying through through you. You know because they’re close by that becomes a much larger opportunity for you to go to VCA procurements, say: hey, we’ve been supporting because they’re new to eat procurement right, so we just launched them like six months ago.

So there could be orders that are happening outside the procurement blog that they’re going to be wanting to rein in right that there might be greater opportunities for you to go to procurement of these order to not only sell to that subset of locations. But now to a broader network right we see that a lot see a lot with like promo. We see a lot in all industries really, but hopefully that answer your question.

Sir. Thank you more questions for Brady. Oh we’ve got one in the back for a couple. People on Koopa yeah: how does the pricing work cuz this Jordan gets a different price than that one? Okay, so not my project that punch on the go pricing, but how does your pricing right right, yeah so remember? So, what’s your e-commerce application? Okay! So there’s a handshake that has to happen between the procurement system.

So again, when we talk about standards, a lot of these systems have unstandardized approaches, but there’s some form of relevant data. That’s happening on click, so when they click to access your store, we might be getting a Duns number or some type of from or to identity like we’re going to be getting some form of information, so that your ecommerce application can’t properly authenticate the user to reflect The correct offering every integration yeah, it’s yeah, it’s through the browser but yeah, but it’s posting data, it’s a great question and that’s another another thing too: it’s if you do again one integration with VCA and at Koopa and then now you got Tesla.

It’s a completely separate engagement. It doesn’t matter that you’ve connected to that Koopa right, even though coop is a SAS based eprocurement system, it’s a completely separate engagement, you’re networking with Tesla’s any procurement team and they have their own rules and so forth. But does that answer your question ma’am it does and and then just to pick up on once somebody else said is I just go to Koopa, but I have to be an approved vendor.

Can I go out there and like post Here I am. Does anybody want to approve me so what a lot of I think the view on that document there. It talks about maybe a little bit of uncovering how your customers like to purchase from their suppliers right. So if you know like those companies that you might be uploading product data to right, those are your first ones. I think you think about going to and saying hey what procurement system are you guys using we’d like to move away from this? Providing you an excel sheet and offer our technology’s right, your gross sales would be good and it makes easier for them.

Um it’s a tough network. It really is again very much relationship driven with the CW’s and Granger’s do. Is they go to all the procurement events right? They have some form of blog manager, of a procurement that is going to these events establishing their relationships, the guy from Amazon. I think his name was a lawyer day he’s like seven foot. Nine he’s really tall dude right, so he goes to every show and he talks to everybody trying to take your business right, but they’re, really just after tail spend you know tail spend is like the the small spend the the products.

They think that a VCA can’t purchase right from others if that makes sense, but it’s a tough network right and it’s not like you, you said it and, and it’s all gold right, it’s it’s a it needs strict focus, but these companies that are going to do These types of integrations with you, if you’re not getting a multitude of orders every day, then there’s a problem right. So it’s it’s not going to be.

I’r going to order for me today and maybe I’ll order from you next week, you are going to be an approved vendor if you can make your way to one of these networks right. If you follow up with us, follow up with me afterwards, we have some other good content with names of eprocurement systems, anything that becomes a little tricky too so, for instance, like Duke University uses Jagger, but if you ask anybody a Duke how they you know where They’re doing a purchaser from they’re going to say I used by a Duke what the hell’s the underlying application is.

You know Jack. If you ask me by a VC a what do you guys use, I use auto right. That’s what they’ve called it! What the heck is all right, that’s a coupon right, but it’s sometimes can be a little tricky navigate. But again, that’s why it takes this focus but don’t lose out on us right and don’t don’t pick yourselves in the butt. If you can’t make your way immediately, it takes a little time, a little dedication, a little focus and it will pay.

I promise you, it’s the fastest-growing blog, be too big, no problem any other questions. I think I’ve over overstayed. My welcome here. Yeah. Oh we’re yanking! You off give it a go for Brady