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Trap Tales – Obstacles to Success with David Covey | Sales Expert Insights

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date June 12, 2020
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My name is John golden from sales pop online says magazine, pipeliner CRM, and today I am delighted joining us from Utah. Is David Covey how you doing David, I’m doing great John? How are you excellent and David? Is the author of trap tales outsmarting the seven hidden obstacles to success and that’s what we want to we want to talk about today, because I mean let’s face it.

You know people struggle a lot a lot with why they’re not where they think they should be right in in their career in their life whatever, but they don’t always they don’t. They don’t always have the capacity to figure out for themselves what it is, that’s holding them back. So can you talk to me a little bit about what was the? What was the origins or the genesis of trap Tales yeah? That was exactly it.

My business partner – and I had Stefan – you know that we co-authored the book. We play a lot of chess together, yeah in chess. The purpose of you know the way to win in chess is to be several moves ahead of your opponent right and actually get them to fall into some traps that you set for them, that you hope that they do. You know they don’t see it because you’re thinking several moves ahead of them.

So so we really like that as a metaphor, and we thought you know go, isn’t that what life is about. You know what life or work life you know or family life. Personal life is about traps that we fall into, and I don’t know if you’re familiar with the force field analysis. Basically it’s the analysis of saying for any initiative. You kind of have your current state, where you’re at sure the desired state where you want to go and you have driving forces or initiatives that are taking you there and then you have a restraining forces and most of time well I’ve found.

Is people really focus on the driving forces and the initiatives to try to help you go from you know here to here right? They don’t pay as much attention to the restraining forces. So it’s the equivalent of like having one foot on the accelerator and another on the break I mean there is not to put you know your foot stronger on the accelerator. You know the pounding it. The answer is to pull your foot back from from the brake.

Really, that’s that’s preventing you, so we like to kind of think of that traps. In that way, they’re really they’re straining forces there the obstacles of the barriers that are preventing us from achieving our goals or reaching our G, their dreams that we want. So because a lot of people I find, I don’t know whether it’s it’s always been like that, but particularly now it seems to be that people drift a lot or they just sort of.

Let’s see what happens and they’re not very proactive about moving their career forward. Whether it’s in sales, whether it’s in whatever but they kind of outsource to faith, that’s what I always called it like outsourcing your destiny to fate. So to talk to me about a couple of the traps like you’re one of the first ones, is the relationship trap right yeah, so we have in the book. We have. You know seven traps, but we’ve created a course: that’s more oriented towards businesses.

So let me focus on some of those sure. If you don’t absolutely, I keep it more business oriented. So one of the the first traps is the busyness trap and that’s drowning drowning, the thick of thin things mmm. We say the thick of thin things, because it’s not the thin things are really not the important things. There’s the non-essentials. There was a study done by the the workforce front that looked at the work that we do the interactions of work and they found that half of the interactions that we have a work are non-essential.

You know they’re just really not that important and if you think about it, you know with technology. You know in tech, back in the 85, they had a study that was done. That said, hey with technology advances coming, you know we’re going to only be working like 30 hours a week. You know because we’ll have so much more time because I’ll picked up, but it’s had the opposite effect. As you know, it’s actually increased the expectations.

So we have all of these things coming at us. We really don’t have a filter or how to manage it or how to control it and – and the answer is, the conventional approach has become a better juggler. You know just learn to juggle everything all the balls in your air and and obviously that’s not going to work. We have to learn to say no. I love the example of Apple for focus. You know when Steve Jobs came back for his second act back in 1997.

He he killed literally like 300 projects that people who were working on and he drew a matrix and he said we’re going to make two products for the consumer and we’re going to make two products for the professional and everything else goes mad. He helped get the company back on track, but it was because of focus. He was willing to focus the company, and today Apple is the most valuable company in terms of market capitalization and they sell most of their sales come from like seven or eight products.

You know it’s through like hundreds of products, but it’s the power of focus. So so that is really one of the traps that we have. Is that we’re just we’re busy, but we’re not really busy on the essential things. So why is that? And and it’s a it’s a it’s a theme of mine that I’ve talked about for years as well. It’s the idea of focus and but focus seems to be so difficult for people, because to focus you have to make choices right as you as you just outlined, and people don’t like making choices, because if you choose one thing you by default, unchoose other things right And people don’t want to do that.

So we talked today about how oh we’re so busy and we’ve got so many things going on but, as you say, a lot of its distraction or non-essential. How do you help get people to focus and to understand what are the important things and to set aside the others yeah? So I think that, first of all, you know you’re going to you got to help people understand that they lead their own life and if they choose to have an adhoc life, there they’re not going to be able to be they’re, not going to be very happy Because they’re just going to whatever happens to them, is what’s going to happen and they’re going to be very disappointed, so you have to help you have to help people say hey.

You know what you have control over your life. You know you’re, not a victim. You know you have yeah, everybody has some bad things happen to them and you always have things that you can’t control, but you can lead your life and you can lead your business and, and you can lead your your marriage, you don’t have to be a victim And so I think that’s the first you know step is to help people realize that they are the controller of their life and they can control their own destiny and then.

Secondly, I think that it’s really important that people think about what their vision is. You know where their direction they’re headed a lot of times, people they get, they get lost or they get distracted or they forget. We have. One of the traps we talk about is the career trap. You know and that’s where people settle. You know in the rare they’re, not happy, there’s really four aspects to a successful career.

It’s the financials. You know you want to be paid fairly. What you do that your mind? You want to have your mind engaged. You know you want to be creatively utilized, the passion is the heart aspect of it. You know you want to be passionately engaged and then you want to be able to feel like you’re, making a contribution, and so many people settle. They just settle in their job. They settle in their life and they they’re living at a much lower level than where they where they could be.

And I think that if you help them say you know see that if you can focus on your core priorities or the things that you really matter and let the other stuff just fall by the wayside, it doesn’t really matter. It really helps them. But my father used an analogy. My father said even a roaster, seven Habits book. He used the analogy of you know of the big rocks and he he had this jar and and it had rocks and pebbles and water and sand, and what what people found is that if you put the the pebbles and the sand and the water in first, You didn’t have time to put the big rocks in you know.

You didn’t have enough room, but if you put the big rocks in first, then you could fit in some of the pebbles and sin, but guess what? If you can’t fit in all the pebbles and sin, so what it’s nice, it doesn’t matter, and so that’s really about what our life is about is that we have to get the big rocks in first. You know, in order for us to you, know, to be successful and to achieve our our vision and our goals that we want.

That’s what really what this is about this book is about. Is you know if you’re, finding yourself stagnated or not achieving the success that you want it’s because of these traps, that you call it in yeah, and it’s in tried a couple of interesting things that you mentioned here about the ad hoc life and III feel that We live in in a culture now of non self accountability. If there’s such a word, but where everything is saying, nothing is your fault and everything is external to you, and that runs counter to what you’re into what you’re saying here and – and I, and I totally agree with what you’re saying so so is that is that A tough thing I mean whether you’re doing this organizationally or from an individual point of view, but to promote this concept of self.

You have to accountability. You have to look at yourself. First before you look at other people hold other people accountable. It’s the toughest day. The toughest thing in the world – and I was formerly at my father’s company Franklin Covey for seniors – that the first habit of the seven Habits is be proactive. And that means that you’re responsible for your life and you’re accountable for the choices that you make.

And you can’t blame others, and that is the toughest thing, because it’s we have such a society today and a culture today of wanting to point the finger at someone else to blame society at large or blame the government or or blame your parents. You know and and it’s it’s just very natural, it’s very hard to take accountability for your decisions and your choices. We like to call these traps, which hopefully makes people feel a little bit better because you could say: hey look, you did you know because a lot of times people you know they they they get where they’re at because someone their stupid mistakes they make.

But if you can start to think about it was like well, maybe it wasn’t so much a mistake. Maybe it was a trap. It was a trap. I got caught in the trap and we like that language because it helped people say hey. You know what you maybe didn’t even fully realize how bad this situation got, but it is the trap and part of the characteristics of some of the traps, and so we’re going to help you get a win you’re going to help you find a way and in The talk about these epiphany breakthroughs.

Yes, the new insights that lead to new breakthroughs in behavior and that’s what that’s what’s important is you can’t do the conventional approaches anymore? They don’t work. You have to do the epiphany breakthroughs that are going to get you to to the new level of thinking yeah, and I love here. I’m one of your subtitles here in one of your chapters and unfocus is the best things in life. Take time and again I love that message, because again it’s runs counter to the pervasive culture out there, the shortcut culture of where oh, no, you can have everything immediately.

You don’t need to. You know, work hard for it. You can just get it. That’s another thing. That’s quite difficult to teach people isn’t it that that, if things that are worthwhile, they actually do take hard work and time. Absolutely. I have a son, that’s playing basketball right now and and he’s got all that you know the natural skills for it, but he’s not at the level of where he wants to be, and he wishes that he could just jump from you know here here, but he Can’t you know he has to make mistakes and he has to learn and he has to practice and he has to work and he has to fail.

You know and and that’s just that’s the process of life, and I wish there was something that I could give him to help him. You know move this faster to speed this on, but I can’t do it and and it’s just how life works. So it’s it’s and it runs counter to our culture, because you know if we want an answer, all we do. Is we google it we get it we’re used to this instantaneous. You know answer and results, and most of life is unfortunately, is not like that.

At least the most important things in life – yeah yeah, I’m now with all this instant digital culture. It’s like people think, oh, I can just become famous and rich by not really doing anything. That’s right and you always hear the stories successful, they’re, successful stories. You know it’s, you know so many they went from. You know working at a grocery store and being living in it. You know 900 square foot apartment too sudden owning their own Island.

You know eight months later you know, and and but you never hear the stories of the people that you know. So those are the outliers you know, but you never really hear the stories of what most people have to do, which is really really hard work for a long time, continuous effort, and eventually you know because of their perseverance and so forth, they succeed. I have a quote big Steve Jobs fan mm-hmm.

I I think it was a great. I don’t he’s necessarily the nicest boss. You know, but I loved his vision. You know, I just think he was just so visionary, but he said. I’m convinced that about half of what separates the successful entrepreneurs from the non successful ones is pure perseverance mm-hmm. I really like that. I’ve been an entrepreneur, the last eight years of my life, and that’s that’s really resonates with me.

Yeah and – and I like also – you – also talk about change right and changes, obviously a very difficult thing, but we – and I think you deal with this – is we’re very good at rationalizing – why we shouldn’t change or irrational izing. Why we can’t change right now or the postponement piece where we want to change, but this just isn’t the right time so in six months time or next year, I’ll get on that yeah, so that that is, that is human nature.

You know is to postpone change and and and to delay it as long as possible. The problem is, is that if you do that, and you wait until, if external circumstances force change upon you, then your options are not very good. You know look at some of the fortune, 500 companies and a lot of them have rested on their laurels yeah and they just kind of think. Well, I can just keep you know doing what I’m doing.

Look at General Electric, I mean I’m shocked and surprised to see. What’s happened with that, you know a truly terrific amazing company for many many years, but is now you know, kind of really fallen in a big way, but I think a lot of it is it’s. Not just individuals his organization’s as well, no absolutely change as long as possible, because it’s difficult and and we’d rather stay in our kind of comfort zone or a little bubble right and the funny thing.

The thing that always amazes me is you know, organizations try and do it and people in in within those organizations try and try and keep everything very controlled the same but as we mentioned earlier, but but that’s not reflective of life right life. It’s a it’s constant. Is it constantly in flux? We don’t know what’s around the corner tomorrow, there’s a surprise and guess what, when it comes good or bad, we’ll deal with it and we’ll figure out a way forward because we have to, but in business we try to create this very controlled environment that totally yet You’re familiar with James Dyson, yes, he created Dyson that bagless vacuum.

So I love. I love him as an example of kind of how how business is done, or you know, or how you create new innovations, and he basically says look. It took over 5,000 prototypes 5,000. Potentates to finally get the perfect, you know vacuum system, and, and it was really a round failure – you know he’s just saying that. That’s that’s really what it’s about, and I think that that’s what we kind of fear is its failure is because we we want to be able to appear like we have everything figured out and you know there’s you know we don’t have any problem, you know and You certainly look at people’s social, you know, media and so forth, and it looks like everybody has a perfect life.

You have that you have a difficult life and you’re wondering what’s wrong with me. You know, but it’s not true. You know it’s all a facade. It really is, but the formula is really try, filler and repeat, and and and that’s really what we need to be taught more about in business and a life is about trying daily learning from that and then repeating any of the great innovations. You know that we we see today all all come from that model yeah and that’s an it, and that obviously requires a company to have a culture of where you can try things and and fail, and I guess part of it is to is, if you’re going To fail like fail quickly right if you care, if you see that there’s I mean I’m sure Dyson when he was doing all his prototypes, I’m sure there were ones where he was.

You know not that far into it and went whoops that not going to work. Let’s go another one early and obviously that’s one of the that’s one of the the traps in businesses that people prolong things. Yes, yeah. They prolong things they wanted. They wish things that you know weren’t that way, you’re familiar with the company Unilever, yes yeah. You know I worked for Procter & Gamble’s, so I used to compete against Unilever in the salt category.

They made laundry detergent, Procter & Gamble, made laundry detergent, but and this this is a story back in the 1960s, its containing the book called black box thinking. But after you Syed he’s a Brit, but anyway he wrote this. He you talked about the story about how the the nozzle, so you have a nozzle that makes the laundry detergent this was before this isn’t like in the in the sixties. You know this was before we had the little pods nation mmm-hmm outer, but the nozzle kept clogging.

So they took it to the mathematicians and, of course, the mathematicians. You know they’re so smart and they can just give us a formula and they and they gave him a formula and it didn’t work so they gave it to the biologist and then the biologist. They were willing to do trial and error and actually what it took is. It took four hundred and forty nine different iterations to produce this perfect nozzle.

It’s this lot, laundry detergent and so to me it’s it’s just. You know Pixar’s another example: yeah Catmull. I a lot of people, see Pixar movies, love, Pixar movies. Well, he says that when we first produced these movies, you know first start working. He says they’re not very good, they suck and he says our job is to take him from sock to non sock, yeah and – and we do that through the iteration process.

We we work, we work, we work until we finally get a great movie. So a lot of times you know we have this image of thinking. Well, there’s people out there that are just geniuses and then there’s me right and and so I’m not genius, so you know I have to I have to work hard, but everybody that has any great success in life has done it through work. Work work led the Beatles. You know we look at the Beatles.

One of my favorite bands was, by the time they got to America in February of 1964, in the Ed Sullivan Show they had performed like 1,200 performances that a Homburg period for 15 months you know – was they perform more during that period than most bands do in Their whole life, you know it wasn’t just yeah, they were, they were, they were geniuses, but they did the 10,000 hour rule. You know that black talks about it and and and it’s really it’s it’s there’s no shortcut.

Yes all work and if you think about it, there’s a the reality is there were probably 10,000 other Beatles out there who didn’t put in the hard work exactly so. This is a great great place to to conclude here, because I think you just touched on something really important as a takeaway is you know whether it’s organizationally, whether it’s personally or whatever, is that you have to start somewhere and then you have to try and try And understand that this is a process, not a I’m, not going to change my life, I’m not going to change my business tomorrow, I’m I can start the process, but it’ll be a process yeah, that’s right and and the one of the main messages in the book And in our program that we teach is the message of hope and it’s that anybody can change the trajectory of their life at any stage of their life.

Okay, so a lot of times. I think we think that oh I’ve, just you know I’ve gone down this road too far or I you know, I can’t change I’m 50 years old or and and it’s hogwash, you know we we can. We, we are the controller’s of our destiny. We can change our life at any any stage of our lives. I think we didn’t have to look at it and say I’m going to do it by making these small steps you know and and taking these small steps new year’s resolutions, the big mistakes that people make a new year’s resolutions as they set too many right step.

N or twelve and so they’re all forgotten by you know by the end of January or February. Oh, so I think the way that you in that change is really by starting small. Don’t try to take on too many things just say: I’m going to do. One thing what you know: one thing differently to affect some of the change and if you start doing that, then you start to build momentum. You start to get some success. It’s not instantaneous, you know, but to see some small successes and some small successes can give you confidence that you’re headed in the right direction.

Then you take another action and then you another action, but the key thing is to take action. You don’t don’t delay, don’t try to take too much action, but take some action that can help you propel you to your goal. Absolutely and if you choose not to take action and you choose not to do anything – that’s fine, but you have to own where you are in your life. It just accept that you’ve chosen an adhoc life, so you’re going to get whatever things are going to come at you and don’t don’t blame, don’t blame your spouse or your parents, or the government or city or whatever, for all your problems that you have exactly.

As I said, I calls on outsourcing your destiny to fate. That’s all my life to fate, yeah, okay! Well, listen! This has been fantastic, but before we go I’d like you to tell everybody just a little bit more about yourself, your organization and how they can learn more about what you guys do, yeah sure. So my business partner is David. Stefan Marv Deeks. He lives in Dallas, Texas, he’s originally from France, so he says Bonjour y’all Texas, but we started this company.

We were both at Franklin Covey. We started a licensing business, so we have opportunities to license intellectual property, the best intellectual property on the planet. Like content, like David Allen’s, getting things done in which we take all over the world, so check us out there at SM Capcom, and then we have our new program, which is called Tripoli, gist at work which emerged from from a trap, Tales book and a trap.

Ologist is a person who detects and avoids the workplace traps. It helps others do the same. So it’s our own term. We made it up. It’s called trap, just at work, calm and so check us out there yeah. I love it a night and I think you know make 2019 the year that you go and uncover all of these traps. So I would encourage you to check out David and his company. My name is John golden says. Pop online says magazine pipeliner CRM.

Thanks again, David, that’s been fantastic, look forward a pleasure, seeing you all again soon, thanks so much for having me John

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Insight Into Empowered Sales Training With Kevin Graham!

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date June 11, 2020
No Comments on Insight Into Empowered Sales Training With Kevin Graham!

I think you’re up in around Torrance today, but you’re based in Orange County, which is just up the road Peter and Kevin. I’m doing great John great.

To see ya and Kevin is a speaker, author, Sales Leader, with a proven track record of aggressive revenue growth, and what we want to talk about today is solution, selling wheel tip of the spear stuff, so um Kevin. Why do you think it’s still so important to focus in on? You know tip of the spear or top of the funnel solution selling well, at the end of the day, organizations aren’t buying a technology or a product they’re solving a problem or in a lot of cases, they’re trying to get to a new state versus a current State right and so, and so a lot of a lot of organizations are heading into you know say the latter part.

A lot of them are on calendar year, fiscal years, so having it heading into the latter part, and – and you know, a lot of companies out – there may be panicking a little bit about the numbers are not shaping up the way they they would like them to. What are some of the things that you think companies can and sales teams and sales managers can start to focus on now to really maximize the last part of the year.

It’s a great question. At the end of the day, sales success to me is about process and execution. You know, sales professionals tend to be highly intuitive and that’s not a bad thing, but it is a risk factor because it comes back to process and execution when you get to where you’re. Having struggling with your close rates, it’s typically a problem with qualifying or who you’re aiming for so anytime.

I work for an organization and try to improve their sales success. It’s a holistic approach because it starts to me again just like negotiation starts before the introduction sales success starts before you define your target market and prospecting, so you know, prospecting qualifying and closing those fundamentals, but at the end you need to be hitting on all cylinders Across the entire lifecycle of the sales cycle, but let’s face it a lot of organizations and sales manner and then spa be sales managers in particular get dragged into this.

It’s like okay, you know we’re running towards the end of the year. I’m going to dive into Kevin’s pipeline, but I’m going to dive into his late stage opportunities and I’m going to help him bring them home. I’m going to come in as a super closer and that’s where I’m going to focus how difficult it is it to get people to go back up the pipeline and realize that where they can make a difference and add value was actually in the early stages and Not coming in as the super closer you know, it’s there’s no substitute for experience right.

There’s. I think what separates the superstars are. The ones who’ve been hit by so many buses they’ve refused to get hit by that particular bus again, so they they protect and prevent. At the end of the day, you can still close on stuff. That’s dodgy, I believe, strongly in tools and techniques like a sequence of events and collaborating with the key decision-makers in that kind of communication back and forth, getting a good cadence back and forth so that there’s commitment on both sides throughout the stages and if you have To bring that in at the late stage, you still can, because that’s part of you know not just taking a sound bite off a call but documenting it with a follow-up email and getting their cut back and forth in that process, so that they are invested in The journey yeah and a lot of times, obviously you can you, can track what happens to you later in the process to what didn’t happen early in the process right so, as you say like getting that, cadence together and one of the things as we know, one Of the traps that people fall into is relying on only one or two contact points at a customer point married to that one contact right, it’s it’s a death trap, and yet we all do it.

It’s just. I think it’s human nature to try to have one partner that one coach, but it’s a flawed approach, especially an enterprise selling. I mean the days of one person. Have a signature authority on a large Spanish is long gone. Its consensus buying and you’ve really got to not just engage across the organization of the stakeholders that are effective, but you really need to protect against blind spot.

It’s because again experience helps and you can get taken out by somebody that’s way out and left field because, yes, the old saying goes, they all don’t have to say yes, but just about any one of them can say no yeah exactly, and I think Gardner has Some good statistics around the the average amount of people involved in a buying decision. As you go up, the you know the size of deal, and I think that’s something people should who are reading should just look at those statistics, because it might surprise you you might say well, I have deals of that size and I only know two people involved In the buying decision and they’re on average is eight.

So what are those who were those other six people right? It’s really trying to end, and I think it comes back to pain winner earlier I mentioned about trying to take them to a future state versus the current state. How you energize that and to me executive level. Engagement is done early early in the sales cycle and late late in the sales cycle. When it comes to approval and the rest of the times, you can kind of flood around with the heavy waited managers and directors, but the highlighting the pain and really you know.

Extracting that helping them understand the implication, you’ll spend the implication of the problem. It is really important because that’s how you’re ultimately going to get funding and and get deal approval. So when you work with them and talk with people nowadays in in some respects, the the landscape has shifted a bit and I think people have moved away from some of the fundamentals, because they’ve kind of got sucked into inbound.

Everything is coming in ready, qualified to you or theirs or their. I have this technology where, let’s face it, I could send their five thousand emails prospect emails today and I could sit back and say done my job. So how do ya? How do you help people can’t go back to the fundamentals and realize that it’s still the hard yards account? Well, it’s a tough thing and it’s it’s it’s context, specific so, depending on your selling model, in your specific business solution, where you affect an organization that types of companies you’re going after the fundamentals of conversational selling or psychology of selling and negotiation are always going to Be important in that one and relationship as selling is kind of come and gone with.

It will always always be relevant to have a relationship, but at the end of the day, in today’s world, you really jet to you’ve got to have a strong pipeline. If you’re going to have sales success because deals are going to fall through even the best of deal, sometimes drag-out, I mean technology sales, I’ve seen guys close deals at you know two or three sales people have worked on over a course of years, and you know I should them have fallen off and then finally, the timings right so there’s a lot that goes into doing big deals mm-hmm.

So what is the number one? What are a couple of the fundamental scales that you really reinforce with people that you think maybe there are being a little more overlooked than they should be well. The simplistic level selling is about prospecting qualifying and closing and at the end of the day, you’re trying to relieve pressure in the sales cycle. You’re not trying to be combative with your partner, it’s more of a dance than a knife fight, but I need to manage.

I think all great salespeople are control freaks to some degree, so you still need to manage any set expectations establish a level of communication of partnership in the process, because how many times have you heard a sales rep come back and all excited about a meeting a Week later, they call a prospect to find out where they’re at with it and the prospect, very barely recalls it and having the meeting trying to establish that and there’s a lesson from the like that bone donors.

They try to get you just one small thing get your client to do. One small thing get them to do you a favor one small thing, and that can be a progression that can build on that establishes a two-way, a back-and-forth yeah. No, I totally agree with you it’s that one where they come back, all excited and say fantastic meeting with the client, and you said: okay. Well, what’s the what’s that follow-up? Go I’m going to meet again in two weeks? Okay, what are they doing between now and to two weeks? And then what do you mean? That’s a well.

What action is the is the sell, is the customer or the prospect taking between now and the meeting? Well, none go great. You just got a continuation. You just go them. You just got another lunch date in two weeks you haven’t actually progressed the sale and that’s the old ABC always be closing. I think most people misinterpret what that managers all about. It’s not about lambasting your prospect with an end.

This block of closing questions. It’s about establishing momentum, momentum toward the close and, to your point, I believe, any objective at any point in a sales cycle is the next step. You’ve got to take that next step, so you know the the selling really doesn’t start until it’s time. Machines begin well a lot of times. The tough questions is closing on that step, whatever that isn’t yeah and and realizing the fact that you’re not you’re, operating on the prospects timeframe, so you’re the one who has to introduce some level of urgency into it because it may not be there, it may be There on their side, but it may not be too so.

Sales is a wonderful profession just about anybody, can get in and put the effort and they learn from their mistakes and grow and be successful. But at the end of the day you got to move the client and and that’s there you know you got to help. So you mentioned prospecting, and this is – and this is one thing that they’re you know that still seems to be a struggle and getting even probably more of a stroke because, as I said, people are getting spoiled by this notion of in the bounding fed hot leads And all of this kind of stuff and and backing off of good old-fashioned prospecting.

So what do you say to the people who maybe are neglecting the good old fashioned prospecting? Well, I say that prospecting is like fitness and if you’re prospecting for three hours, every third Thursday you’ll develop neither fitness nor effectiveness. If you decide take on a new fitness regimen and whether that’s walking two miles a day or something more intense, there’s lots of fear, uncertainty and doubt fun little confident we’re the right shoes.

All I forgot my music. Oh, I didn’t bring the right water. Oh, this treadmill sucks, you know at the end of the day, you’ve got to put those distractions aside and commit to the activity, because it’s about productivity results and feedback. If the productivities there, the results will be there. If the productivity is there and the results are not there, there will be mounds of feedback. The marketplace is self sharpening.

You just have to continue engaging, but to be an effective prospector. You need to not find a time but make the time on a regular basis. Yeah and you kind of got to embrace it right because it’s fundamental to what you’re doing and yes, we live in there. Unfortunately, we live in a culture today that celebrates short that doesn’t really and doesn’t really celebrate, paying your dues or putting in the hard yards.

So but you got to realize, as you said, if you want to be successful, you have to not just sort of go. Oh, I got to do my prospecting, but you got to say right got ta, do my prospecting and you have to recognize that the top of the sales funnel is a VIP very messy place. You take any singular activity. It’s tough to tie an ROI directly to that. It’s the old Wanamaker. You know half the money I spend on advertising.

I waste, I use, don’t know which half at the end of the day, you’ve got to commit, and I try to challenge people to have two or three very specific modes, because some people there’s so many social platforms. There’s so many engage, there’s so many ways to connect, have two or three primary and just commit to them, commit to them from an activity and a Productivity standpoint and the results or the feedback will come, and you also may be successful yeah and I think to Your point, though, I think it’s all and it’s always a combination.

It’s never one thing and I think that’s that’s the trap. A lot of people have fallen into, especially with all these tools that have come out where they think. Oh, if I just use this great like prospecting tool, I don’t have to do anything else and you go it’s never that simple. It’s always a combination of activity right and part of that human nature. I think if you look at the usage numbers on a tool, a phenomenal tool like LinkedIn Navigator companies, invest in at an enterprise level, yet very few.

Their sales reps take advantage of the monthly allotments of engagement, and you know at the end of the day, it’s about riding the bike not about when I say which bike yeah. So what are some of the other areas that you really focus in on helping people, and especially with one eye towards the latter half of the year? Well, so you want to close right. There’s lots of leads don’t age well, if you’re taking leads or you’re doing a lame job of engaging and not really just waiting for that thing to kind of self grow, that’s a challenge, but there’s opportunity to re-engage but you’ve got to be passionate.

You know, I believe, rule number one in sales is you got to drink the kool-aid if you’re not passionate and excited about what it is you’re doing how in the world you expected got in the other side of the table. The kid excited enough to make a decision and take action, but I think if you can re-energize, your focus maybe put some incentives out there, whether you’re self created. Sometimes we have to play mind games of herself just a drive through those hours of calls, but at the end of that you can reinvigorate a pipeline.

You just met approach it but very focused standpoint about what you’re seeking and again that’s the next step in the sales process. If you can’t get him to cross that bridge you’re not going to be able to get him to make the long journey ya know it’s. It’s a good point and I think that idea of keeping yourself energized and engaged – I had a great conversation, a number of months back with Santa misguides Kenton Lee, but he said that when he was prospecting right, he said you know.

If I make X amount of calls today and I make three appointments and I’m going to reward myself – we were reading a movie tonight. He goes. If I make you know all of my prospecting calls and I don’t make any appointments, but I’ve really worked hard. I tried I give myself a small reward because I put the effort in and that way it’s not an all-or-nothing. As long as I can look at myself and say I did everything I could tomorrow’s another day, I’m going to repeat it again right and getting some noise here, but oh yeah.

I know it’s you’re good. Hopefully it’s not troubling. At the end of the day, you’ve got ta hit the numbers, and you know you need to embrace it. One guy came out two years ago called the note quote: a look. If every yes is worth a thousand dollars – and it takes you four noes to get to that – yes, then each knows worth a couple hundred dollars. Yeah recognize that thank you for that. No I’ll call on you another time – maybe maybe not, but on the next celebrate that no because you’re never going to get your one.

Yes, unless you average, those four knows you’ve got to embrace the rejection, try to learn from it, but the end of the day. Don’t take it personal, it is always going to be a numbers game to some degree. You’ve got to engage at a competitive level. Yeah and I think that’s the point. I think it is always a numbers game to some degree. As you say, and despite everything, I don’t think that really changes and – and the point is it’s – it’s almost getting harder because we live in such a distracted society where people are so distracted all the time that, even if you do engage with somebody, they may have Every intention yeah, they may have every intention in the world of engaging back with you, but they get distracted, so you’ve got to keep going right and that’s persistence and it’s also being aware right because so many times we’re so busy talking in so many.

You know. Thinking about our own energy, but we’re not attuned to what the customers doing and that could be in a 1:1 conversation throughout the you know, solution selling in the whole gamut of factors, but you need to be cognizant that you’re, not necessarily at the top of the Prospects list, as far as their priorities, you’ve got to find a way to get in front of mine and yeah, and that’s tough.

As you know, I mean it’s really tough, because you want to close your deal and and it’s tough to realize that yeah the prospect. Maybe they really want to need what you have, but you don’t know about the 50 other things that’s competing for your attention. Right now, right, well sig, the late great Zig Ziglar said for every prospect you lose because you’re too enthusiastic. You lose 100 because you weren’t enthusiastic enough – and I know it’s not just about enthusiasm of people – feel when you’re genuine when you’re sincere interested in their problem.

Their solution you can persist and you feel like you’re, knowing them and you’re, leading on voicemails or you’re calling and calling and calling you know you could annoy them at some point. But at some point those emotions start to change. I mean I’ve had prospects where I’ve called and called and called and they’ve told me to stop, stop stop and at some point the time turns and they start to show a respect and they appreciate your persistence and then they give you a true attention.

You know, there’s no there’s no set answer it takes. It takes a grind, something yeah. It does absolutely okay, but we’re bumping up against the end of our time Kevin. But before we go once you get a chance to tell people a bit more about yourself what you do and how they can learn more about you, hey, that’s great John. I really appreciate, but before I do, I just want to congratulate you guys, because I know you’re evolved a pipeline or to a connected yeah Gartner Magic Quadrant.

We were, we were so excited about that it was our first year we applied, we got on it. The first year we got on it in a very prominent position, so we’re pretty thrilled about that yeah. It is a major it’s not just that the analyst kind of perspective, but you know a lot of people, don’t realize that’s measured on the completeness of vision and the ability to execute you guys are very highly rated on your ability to execute and to me that’s That’s what it’s all about in the vision you can pack in as as times go forward, but you’ve got to execute.

You guys are doing that. So it’s great to be associated with you guys. So I have Kevin Graham, have a and Kevin Graham speaks it’s my speaking brand I’ve been a sales training brand. I’ve even got a article brand that we do article for business growth. But if you go to Kevin Graham speaks comm, you can get a free copy of my latest ebook, the the sales success, the power of customer intimacy, which talks about how to really truly understand your customer.

Because that’s you know, as I say, if you, if you bear hug the customer, that not only tell you what the winning hand needs to be they’ll tell you when to play which cards yeah. That’s fantastic, listen, Kevin! This has been great. I hope you have a great rest of the day. Thank you. Everyone for tuning in my name is John Gould and sales pop online says magazine. Pipeliner CRM see all further expert interview really soon.

Thank you. Thank you. John great day.

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Getting Things Done! with David Allen | Sales Expert Insights

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date June 5, 2020
No Comments on Getting Things Done! with David Allen | Sales Expert Insights

My name is John golden from sales pop online says magazine and pipeliner CRM, and today I am joined by David Allen, who is the author of getting things done? The art of stress-free productivity and he’s joining me from Amsterdam in Holland, the Netherlands, whichever you like to call it hey, do you know it Oh glad to be here, John thanks for the invitation yeah.

So David tell me your book, as we were just discussing earlier. Your book is sold, you know over 2 million copies and has been translated into, I think you said 38 languages or something so obviously it hit a nerve when you release this book about, you know getting things done and the art of stress-free productivity, okay, so productivity. Rarely do people associate productivity with stress free right, so tell me a little bit about what you mean by stress-free productivity.

Well, if you see Olympic athletes before they go into the final game, what do you see them doing? Stretching and relaxing mm-hmm, so the most relaxed state, where you’re, totally present and relaxed not distracted, is the most productive state to hit a golf ball from to do an Olympic event from to have a difficult conversation from or to have a conversation with a sales client And I’m really from right, where there’s nothing else on your mind, you’re totally present, so you can be present with them to find out who they are, what rings their bell and and engage with them appropriately.

So it’s about appropriate engagement really. So what do I need to do to get my head clear and the problem these days is: if most people are you trying to use their head as their office in your head to crap the office mm-hmm, so you know you’re trying to keep track of. If you try to keep track of more than four things, you’re screwed, you can be driven by latest and loudest as opposed to strategy. So there’s a real note for your salespeople.

I’m sorry! You got more than four things in your head. You will be driven by latest and let us not by who you ought to call right now or what you ought to do to spend time to think about. You know your strategies, yeah, and I know if I did. I love that point there, because one of the things that I find nowadays is like people love to tell us, and we all do love to say how we’re far busier than we ever before.

Right and – and I always say, are we really or are we far more distracted than we ever were before, because you know now we have a thousand things popping up on our screens and our phones and everything we can. We can distract ourselves that the you know every nanosecond if we want yeah it’s. The John is the stress of opportunity. Mm-Hmm, you know you’re getting relaxed if you get into a crisis, if your house or your apartment come, you know, goes into flame trust me you’re, going to relax because there’s only one thing you could do call live survive.

What’s the next step? Where do I go? What’s my outcome called get out of this place? What do you need to do and tires on your car and your taxes for the year and the person you need to hire all that all those get put on the back burner, so most people actually move into their zone and a crisis. I just discovered how you get into your zone without having to wait for a crisis to get you there. So so, let’s talk about that, then how do you, how do you get into into your zone without needing a crisis to get you there? You take everything that has your attention little or big, and you get it out of your head.

You write it down. You stick it into someplace that you know you’ll see sooner or later, and then sooner than later you decide. What’s the next action on cat food? What’s the next action on higher VP? What’s the next action on get a life? What’s the next action on? Should I get divorce or not, and you need to make those kind of clarification decisions so there’s five stages to how you get anything under control? First of all, you identify the stuff, that’s not in control mm-hmm! You know that’s the capture step, then you clarify okay.

What do I need to do about mom’s birthday? What do I need to do about hiring the my EP VP? What do I need to do about a potential divorce? You need to make those decisions which most people avoid like the plague, and then you say: okay, what’s the fair, and once I decide that I need to call my sister about mom’s birthday. I need to my divorce. I need to talk to my life partner about you know. What is he or she think about what we ought to do about this right now, and are you okay by that? So that’s a conversation so anyway clarifying the next action and the outcomes desired.

Step 2. Step 3. Organize the results. You can’t finish the thing the moment you think about it, mark a reminder of who you need to call what you need to talk to people about step before step back and reflect and review the whole inventory of the 16 errands. You need to run the six things you need to talk to your life partner, about the the forty-three things you need to do at your computer. Whatever you better take a look at all that inventory before you can feel comfortable about what you then decide step 5.

You need to review it step 4 and then step 5 is engage. What do I decide to do out of all that? Crap mmhmm yeah, all that stuff, that’s out of my head. I look at it, but most people are pretty smart and all you have to do is take a look at all your errands and you make a decision about which one to do all you have to do is take a look at all the stuff that you Ought to be writing on your computer or drafting or or doing whatever, and some part of you is going to be.

You know a good bit smarter, but the problem is if you’re trying to use your head as your office, which is a crappy office, and you got all that stuff banging around in there you’re not going to make good decisions about it, yeah yeah! No, it’s a highly it’s a highly cluttered and very disorganized office for most people. If you do so it it’s interesting, so part of a part of what you are really saying is I mean I think it’s a very.

If I go back to one of the first things you said because I always think this is a really important and critical piece is the things that are outside of your control right. We focus a lot and fixate a lot on things that we have absolutely no control over as opposed to you know it narrowing it down to things that we do have control away. Why do you think people do that? I don’t know a lot of people get addicted to worry, how stress and so they’ll find something to stress about whether it’s the weather or your boss, or your teenager or whatever.

But then you have to decide see. My mission in life is to create a planet where there’s no problems only projects mm-hmm all right, you give me anything, that’s a problem. I say why do you consider it a problem? It’s because you think it needs to be different than it is you’re, just not engaged making yourself nice, it’s quite simply. So what what are the things that you’ve got on your mind? What are the things that you need to manage and get appropriately engaged with? It? Doesn’t mean you’re going to change, the planet doesn’t mean you’re, going to fix all the things you want.

It just needs to be it. You need to get appropriately engaged with it, so you feel comfortable about what am I going to do it? What am I doing about my neighbor? That’s complaining about the tree that I just planted. Now that’s going to block their view right, there’s a project that you can call that a problem I say: look, what’s your project get resolution with neighbor not needs to go in our project list.

What’s your next step, talk to your attorney, talk to your landscaper talk to their landscaper em. What’s the next step, and most people avoid all that? That’s why that’s what’s creating so much stress out there? They have so many things they could be thinking about would like to be doing. You know coming after your parent and your kids two years old, but you want to get them into Harvard how many of your of your neighbors have already figured out that the the workshops their five year old, is going to then you’re missing out on.

Oh, my god, and so the stress of opportunity is what’s creating a whole lot of what the stress is going on out there see the world is fine, look outside your door right now, John yeah, the world’s not overwhelmed! It’s not confused. It’s only you based upon your relationship to it. I just figured out the algorithm or the formulas about what do you need to decide think about Park as an extra external system for yourself that allows you to stay clearer about all the stuff you’re engaged in and what do the things that I saw interesting on Your on your bio is so you you’re a black belt in karate right I was in my twenties.

I mean I’m still kills. I can still kill you in a second but you’re. A martial artists, yeah, I’m a martial artist to you so so be. We could have an interesting sparring session, but just going back to what you were saying there, I mean the essence of martial arts is that you really do have to calm yourself focus and get yourself into a calm state and when you’re in a calm and a Focused state, you can achieve lots and lots of great things, but but, like you, like you say in in what you were saying about your book, but you can’t focus on ten things at once.

Right all right. She could just get knocked out right. You can’t multitask, you can you, can you can switch tasks fast? Yes, you know come on John, if you get attacked by four people: you’re not going to fight for people that wants you one at a time, but very quick refocus, and so you can learn to refocus quickly. What you don’t want to is try to manage things that you can’t complete the loops while you’re dealing with them.

So then you’ve got all these open loops that keep pulling on your psyche that that prevent you. You know if you’re worried about three people that might jump you from the next alley that guy’s going to hit you in the face, because you you just got distracted right right so that that’s the that’s essentially that’s why I call this a martial art. That’s sort of the art of life of managing the flow of life’s work is, is how do I keep track of all the things that I’ve allowed into my echo system that are taking my attention and how do I free up my attention from them? Not to not to ignore them but to make sure I’m appropriately engaged with them.

In other words, if, if I don’t know do you have any pets, yeah yeah, dog, okay right? So if cat food pops it to your mind more than once, you are inappropriately engaged with your cat. If we need cat food, if you go to the fridge and put it on a post-it on the fridge that whoever goes the store, they combine canned food, we’ll get it next. It’s off your mind mmm. But meanwhile, if you haven’t done that, I need cat food.

Will pop in your mind, at 3 o’clock in the morning in the bed, when you can’t do scrap about so again, unless you’ve externalized all of these things, so that you can evaluate them, you objectify them clarify them. Have them as an inventory for your in. You know for how you evaluate things on a regular basis. You can’t take a power nap you’re, going to take an avoidance. Nap yeah have a have a power beer you’re going to take an avoidance beer.

You look like the same beer. They’re very different. One is hey. Look at all that stuff. I’m going to have a beer instead. Is that yours, better than a whole lot of other things right, I enjoy it. It’s great fabulous, but so I mean and and and part of this is right is, I think, sometimes our people get caught up in this idea of like so. My desk is piled with and I’ve got all this stuff going on and I’m so busy and it’s almost it’s almost an avoidance of what you’re talking about here and it’s really prioritizing right and really looking at what needs to get done and where and looking at What what are the important things that you need to do and get those out there? You know China.

I want to be I’m going to be a bit of an asshole about this and say yes, people focus too much on priorities. Mm-Hmm. You know a lot of people should not set goals, they need to clean their toilet. No, if your day-to-day is out of control, don’t try to think about bigger stuff. No one’s going to do is frustrate you and create more guilt, which you don’t need. It’s going to undermine your productivity, so use it to be in control of whatever has got your attention.

Little big, personal professional. If I ask you hey, what’s on your mind, you say where I want to be ten years from now: it’s a fabulous! What’s your desired outcome, or do you want to be ten years from now and I’ll? Have you just define that as best you can, let’s say great? What’s the next step, if you had nothing else to do right now, but to move on that to get closure on get progress on it move the needle, would you go to a computer right now? Would you go to your life partner right now? Would you go to the hardware store right now? What’s next so outcome, an action become the zeros and ones of productivity.

Right like what am I trying to produce with this client? What what would be that you know if you’re in a sales context? What do I want to have true an hour from now mm-hmm after this conversation? Great? So what’s the next step? What do I need to do about that? So this is a whether you’re a nine year old or the CEO of a global corporation I’ll coach. Both it’s the same questions hi. Would you like to experience for the party today great? What do we need to do? Hi? You know.

What do you want to have true in terms of your your the company you’re, trying to run right now? Look at we’re. What’s the big picture when you grow up, what do you want to be great? What’s the next step, who’s got it. So these are the same questions. It’s it’s. Basically, the thought process or the cognitive process, the thinking, a decision-making process that allows you to clarify all the stuff you will out come into your ecosystem, mm-hmm, and so basically, what you’re saying is, I you know, obviously to think you want to achieve, and then you Need to actually take action and look at the next best step towards achieving that.

Well, you don’t have to take that action, but you did define what it is. You don’t want to avoid it because you don’t know what it is right. You just don’t do it because they’re other and more important things right now, but it’s still on your list mm-hmm to do when I have time and is to keep evaluating that against all the other things that you might need or want to be doing, but that You don’t end that process, that’s not something that you put to bed and never have to keep doing no you’re doing that forever.

Mm-Hmm. Every time you decide to do something you just decided to do a to not do a lot of other things, and – and I think and that’s that I think, is something that I hope everybody takes note of, because that’s one of the things I talked to people A lot about is when you make choices, and this is why I believe, but a lot of people don’t like making choices, because when you choose something you by default, unchoose other things right and we done and we like to have all of our solutions.

If you don’t make decisions, you just chose not to make decisions about any of that right. So you’re constantly, and it’s not a matter of whether you’re making decisions not to know which decisions are you’re making. If I’m avoiding deciding what to do about a potential divorce or about hiring somebody and more about what to do with this client, that’s still a decision. You can’t stop decision-making you’re just making.

That is that the right decision, or is that the best decision is that the decision that will get this off your mind outsourcing to face yeah. Actually what you need to do is is add source. You need to source your intuition mm-hmm. That says: okay, given all that stuff, that I have to do, what is my still small little inner voice telling me is the thing that will give me the most value. Take a nap, have a beer call that client sit down and draft this proposal now.

So I that’s why I say I tend to push up against people who have a simplistic answer to how do you set priorities, because it’s so subtle? So as soon as you decide to take a nap, you decided that was more important than anything else in your life yeah, but you can only feel good about what you’re not doing when you know what you’re not doing John. So that’s the problem most people have is they have no clue of how many things they’ve committed to that they’re not aware of now, but they feel or pulling on.

So that’s a lot of what my methodology does is get them to become more conscious about. I need cat food, I need life, I need a new vice president. I need you know. I need tires on my car to handle my next vacation. That’s on my radar and do you find or do you feel as we come up against the end here, and do you feel that this is becoming more of an issue I mean, do you feel people are becoming, maybe more, you know avoiding more durkas will abort Before opportunities, you have the more you’re going to avoid nice right and because we live in, we live in the world.

That’s bombarding us. We we’ve got a big opportunities. How many things could? How many think could you and I right now if we stop doing this, how many think could you and I surf on the rip right now that might add value to what’s coming up on your calendar tonight or tomorrow or this afternoon or whatever come on yeah? It’s just now, that’s infinite. I mean I had an encyclopedia britannica, but I could look up stuff and I had that bulletin board.

On my laundromat I could look up the cool things and I had a telephone that I could talk to my girlfriend when I was 14 for two hours. So distraction is, you know, is kind of a universal potential opportunity. It’s just now. Your girlfriend is available 24/7 and he or she is checking his checking in with you and they’re checking in there. You know it’s like this is not a one. This is not a one time to our phone call.

This is a 24/7 accessible to all those dings. Then may show up and that’s highly addictive. It’s so there’s a there’s, a real problem with with all of that that opportunity and it’s it’s highly addictive. And how much do you think, then that, but but it’s also giving a lot of people a get out of jail card for themselves right because they just go on like you know, I can’t get anything done well come on.

You know, that’s just BS. You know. There’s people just unconscious, I’m sorry, I can’t can’t say much about that other than now. You know to that point. You know not to be too facile at that point. A lot of these opportunities are are just creating the greater challenges for people to decide what they’re doing and what’s important and what strategic, what really matters III meant social yeah. I got more than a million followers on Twitter.

You know, and I hang out on Instagram a little bit – Facebook or whatever, but that’s just a cocktail party to me, so I don’t have to go to cocktail parties. I’ve just got one, so I just want wander in and out chat when I won’t add things when I won’t look at things whatever. I think that’s really cool, what a great world we live in, that we have those opportunities. That’s global because I have a global network of people that I you know play with and interact with and engage with, but I don’t have any commitment to do anything other than wander in or wander out, mm-hmm.

So, and if you really know what you’re doing you know, how much time you ought to give that and how much importance you ought to give that and whether that’s just an engagement, fun thing to let your brain rest and have some fun and socialize what’s wrong With those things, those are great as long as they’re done in inappropriate proportion so that you’re balanced about what you’re doing and not using those as a way to avoid the article you need to write or the person that caught the difficult conversation you need to trigger.

You know, or whatever mm-hmm well, listen David. This is this has been great. Actually I could talk for a long more a lot longer, as I think there’s a this is a great message and I think obviously it’s a message. That is, I think, it’s more important than ever right now, because I do believe a lot of people are hiding behind chaos and not taking taking action in their lives. I I could see examples of it every day, so I think it’s about getting things down.

The art of stress-free productivity, so thanks David for sharing some of those insights with us today, thanks John for the invitation happy to do that happy to share all this information with whoever is interested. Have they come back whenever you might want me yeah, absolutely and just before we go, how can people find out more about you getting things done come? Is our website and you’ll see a lot of our global partners? We have a partner in the Ireland and the UK.

That’s doing public seminars there, as well as in 60 countries. So if you just go to our website, you’ll see where you might want to take a public seminar or get coaching individual coaching about this methodology that I have an of course get my book Danielle edition. Getting things done, you know it’s the Bible. They know of all this absolutely and it’ll also be available in the sales part library for purchase.

So again, thanks David John golden says: pop online says magazine, pipeliner CRM, see again for another expert inside interview very soon.

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Storytelling For Sales Success with Brian Parsley | Sales Expert Insights

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date June 3, 2020
No Comments on Storytelling For Sales Success with Brian Parsley | Sales Expert Insights

My name is John golden from Sarris pop online says magazine and pipeliner CRM, and today I’m joined by Brian parsley, who is in lovely Charlotte North Carolina. How you doing Brian top of the morning to you, Brian’s Irish as well? Well he’s not he’s South African there / American right at this age, I’m American all the way right: okay, so Brian’s a professional career! So he you started at the bottom.

Worked your way up from temporary staffing agencies, you did door-to-door selling and from that you you experienced and founded successful startups, and now you are consulting you, help organizations with sales, optimization and another sales related and leadership related things. Well, I thought we talked about today. Is okay, we’re at the at the beginning of November? A lot of people have, you know, just under two months, left of selling for this year and desperate, trying to close hit their quota or or hit those accelerators.

So closing is obviously a big issue right now. So Brian, when we were talking beforehand we’re talking about the use of how to use a storytelling, can actually increase your your probability of closing. So do you want to talk a little bit about that sure? I think that, as we go here to the end of the year, there’s a couple things we need to make sure we keep in check number one a lot of times. People see the end of the year as time to start pulling back holidays here in America, Thanksgiving and then creative and even overseas.

You stopped Africa as an example. No, you know December till mid-june where things just shut down, and I think that’s a mistake. If you want to have a strong first quarter, you need to end, and at least 10 the momentum going into that fourth quarter. So that’s one day now just want to throw out there yeah just push harder than you’ve ever pushed ever in your life. This sort of thing when you talk about people are looking too close when you talk about closing in a moment, but storytelling in general isn’t necessarily closed concept.

I would, I know from experience, has been this our goal itself. Professionals is not really the cell. Our goal is twofold: number one to connect. I want to be a connector, I’m going to look for ways and opportunities to say: oh gosh, this guy is an insurance agent. Maybe he needs a realtor, this guy’s a doctor. Maybe he needs an insurance agent. So I’m constantly pivoting my my contacts to make introductions to be what they’re nothing your business together is one thing, but I want to be known as the guy that puts them all together if that makes sense, yeah totally that’s why networking events networking not that tricky People go to there and and and and they tend to hang out with other people like them, but but there are great opportunities to meet folks just by going out there trying to connect with other people.

The second thing is: what’s your biggest goal in sales? Well, you might let chop this down. You ready. John yep goal is to manipulate other people. That’s what you’re supposed to do as a salesperson to manipulate, but there’s a little back into that before you start throwing tomatoes at me. It’s manipulate with good intent right and the best way to describe that is, if you’re, a parent. You manipulate your children with good intent and guide that to the decisions that you believe in know in your heart are the most important things for them to keep them safe, ldiots smart as they grow older.

So keep that in mind here as we go forward. You know, I think, it’ll make a lot more sense when we talk about story time. No, that’s that’s great, because one of the things we used to use in in another role I was in with another company, is one of the rules of communication. Is that you know people believe conclusions they come to by themselves and anything you or I can say to them right so part of your job is to guide them to come to those conclusions and, as you said, if you manipulate a good intent or you guide, Somebody to conclusion with good intent, because you know this is going to help them.

Then that’s that’s a good thing to do a hundred percent in you’re dead on. So let’s talk about storytelling, here’s, the fact the fact is facts are forgot. Facts are forgotten. Stories are retold and when you load down the when you look down the prospect or your customer with facts, figures, values and the features of benefits and all that Mister forget it they don’t. You know why, because they really don’t care the business infomercial czar so powerful to do nothing but tell a story.

Don’t your native of tomorrow with it. I’ve never trusted tomato all the way down the tape, but you start reading it go that could happen yeah. I want that yeah because they’re establishing a pain through a story. You live the story by curiously and they don’t talk about the price. They just tell you the story and then you want it, and I also believe that by telling stories it helps people relate now.

Actually, I take it back before I tell you the story part. I want to share with you an example, and this is a real example that happen for me. How do you connect with people? Well, one way to do – and this is going into your answer to the question about November and event year – closing things you have to make sure that you’re connecting with people and there’s a pre called preparation is a big thing that a lot of people need to Get better at mmm what I call rapport investigation before you go meet with your clients.

You want to connect with them. Part of the storytelling is connecting right, so I want to find ways that we can connect together. So how do you do rapport investigation or internet stalking, as it’s known, we of course, that LinkedIn and Facebook, and things like that, and – and certainly I would never say to you that I’m looking up your Facebook right now and go? Oh, my goodness, he loves, he loves Italian food.

Hey John! I like Italian food. Do you that’s creepy yeah? But if I do see like as an example, I’m a freemason and if I saw on your page that you’re part of a freemason group, you know or a club, then then what we call it objects. But then I would look at it and go. Maybe I’ve thrown out a sign or symbol or something anyway be pretty hard to do. The funny handshake go through virtually yeah [, Laughter, ].

So then, but I’ll give you an example. So I was with the financial advisor and we were going on a call to a lady, and this is something I throw in a road kind of show with these folks and she’s, like one meeting this lady’s the third time she’s not friendly, she sees me. I think out of obligation gee, I can’t seem to close her and I don’t know what it is. I’ve done everything that’s like well, let’s look her up on Facebook and sure enough.

It was locked down. I couldn’t see anything but I said, click the about likes and we moved in their lives and they were all kinds of cool things like. I think it was two wall with this and chill all a rescue wow. That’s weird, and I don’t why she just. I have a twat, I do, and I say do is: take a picture of your Chihuahua put it on your desktop right and when we go before we get started just open it up see the manipulation with good show up sure enough.

She opens it up and lady goes. What is that Chihuahua? She is yes, that’s my chihuahua. Now you wouldn’t want to do this. If you didn’t have a, are you serious best friends, they created this report and they were able to push through and then you shelah WA as the common denominator or the story or the vessel and the nice. And so just going to say – and the nice thing about that Brian is that that has that has taken some of the tension and maybe the wall away.

So now you can have a real conversation. It doesn’t mean that you’re going to sell to them or close them just because you have the Chihuahua but you’ve created the best environment. I will tell you this. I always say that you can act professional, but you got ta talk, Fredman mm-hmm, you know like people, people can see through that. I have a 13 year old and I was just telling me the other day. I said her name’s Alexis unless it out you’d have to be careful the way you come across.

I know your heart. I know your intent, but sometimes you come across as an authentic, hey. How are you – and I know, you’re trying to be polite, but it comes across fake itself. Professionals, I see it every day. Do the same thing, not intentionally it’s not their intent, but it’s what people see you have to remember that. You know you know 52d. I think it’s 54 % of communication is nonverbal or 53 and another 38 % is.

How do you say it yeah? So maybe vast majority of our communication aren’t even the words. That’s why stories are so powerful. No there’s five parts to any story, and this is nice. It’s really easy. Once upon a time there was the hero, the hero went on a journey right and on the journey they met a challenge that could be a dragon. It could be her hair, whatever it is mm-hmm, then the hero somehow someway figured out a way to slay that dragon, and then they lived happily ever after mm-hmm.

What’s fun at I’m a hero. When I was a journey by the challenge you know just solve the challenge, then there’s the five parts to a story everybody’s like that everything’s, very just like that, so we say, and every sale is like that. Well, here’s why once upon the time we had a customer very similar to you, they were looking to achieve this output X Y Z, and this is the challenge that they face. This is what we did for them, and now they don’t happily ever after.

So what you do is you create stories around objections? Your costs too high. You had a bad experience in the past. Only use this other competitor. No, we don’t have a need right now. So let’s say we used you in the past and five years ago and and we have bad experience, you know I totally understand. In fact I have a customer very similar to you. Then we’re looking to you know, build what I don’t know what we’re selling but sure we’re looking to achieve and they had a challenge.

The challenge was: we dropped the ball. The challenge was our company failed them, but then I did a little bit of research and I figured out it wasn’t the company. It was that Account Executive, and this is where they dropped the ball, and this is what we did for them, and not only do they love what we put into play, but now there are a loyal customer because they know that not only am I responsible, but I’m accountable for everything that happens within this organization and then so I’m basically saying that won’t happen to you, but the truth of the story, their inner mind.

You know envisioning this so that they’re going to say, oh well, that makes its automatic proof yeah and you’re. Not and you’re not trying to deny that there were issues in the past right. I mean you’re as you you’re, explaining how you learned from those how you overcome them and how you’ll ensure that they never happen again and when you said about you were just saying about the authenticity: that’s more authentic! Isn’t it then saying like oh well? No, you know, we’ve never had issues like that or that absolutely one it’s much or more, that you just say yeah.

We had those kind of issues and here’s what we did to solve it. I you know get more frustrated when I have a problems for where they want to give me the reasons why I’m wrong, when I’m a customer, yeah and or the excuse, it’s not just apologize and move on and take responsibility, and you know I always love this. I say I’d rather take and I work with companies. You know helping them create more loyal customers.

So when the biggest challenges is they ignore or they try to avoid upset customers. In my my I would postulate imma take a a very upset customer over and okay customer, because I think an upset customer and turn them into someone loyal way quicker than a transactional customers a way to defuse. It is to obviously agree with them. Now I’ve used two different examples, but but they both come down to the to the end.

Where I had a lady just escalated up to me, they said, can you please deal with her? She cuts us and screams and that’s like hey. My name is Brian, and so I’m sort of asked me to give you a call and then she let inter and I’m talking about. I don’t think she took her breath for three minutes straight, just yeah. Every other keywords: okay and – and I didn’t say a word in fact – I didn’t even acknowledge service list mm-hmm or anything just quiet and at the end I was quiet even after she stopped and if she thought I hugged up she’s like Hello, that’s like go.

I’m here and she’s like well, what do you have to say about that? And I said I’m silent because I have nothing to say I said I’m. I can’t believe you’re not more upset than you are now when you say that to someone and it comes across something weird. I said: how dare you agree with me? Yes, I can’t believe you’re not more upset than you are, because if it were me, I wouldn’t even have this phone call.

I would just move on right. The fact that you are taking this phone call shows me that you care you care enough, that you want to make sure that you, let us know, and even though I may not be able to save you as a customer, and never what this to happen to Anyone else, in fact, to tell you that this happened one out of ten thousand times it’s irrelevant, because you’re the one and it’s a hundred percent of you and I get that she’s and and then typically what happens when you do that? Not only do you are you telling this story by, you know relleno wrinkle, but but typically they’ll, then back off and say well, what do you think we should do and and in the goal, obviously is to manipulate your customer and I’ll share with you? This other part of the story assist, have you ever gone to a restaurant or store, and you had such bad service such a bad experience that you swear.

You never go there again, oh yeah too many times, but is it plausible that no one else in that organization subscribes to that same belief that that person created four year, meaning that one-off experience could be that individual then yeah we’re judging the whole cup that one? Incredibly important every other, actually you have with the customer every time good and in fact the once entertainment but still get food.

Let’s answer our phones good afternoon, thanks for the food table, yeah absolutely and it’s it and it’s intro because, as you said there is you know if people are upset. If customer you know, if we’ll take ourselves right, if we’re upset with an experienced, what is the one thing that we really want we want to? We want to be acknowledged and we want to be heard right. That’s what we want and when people fail to do that, it just makes you more angry and then you just go away and you say forget it, but if they acknowledge it and they listen to you, then they there’s a chance of rehabilitation and not just that.

As we know, I let me ask you about that particular particular customer. Did they remain a customer and lay one of your loyal secretary or the crisis control guy so when they have an escalated issue, this is a pretty substantial a lot of times. My clients will call me into but again you know feeling like you’re feeling valued appreciated, appreciation as a currency. That’s accepted around the world and and it’s so easy to give, and yet you don’t really share it very often, because I just as an aside on this, because I had an experience recently where I had to follow this was my owner to follow up on something That I, that I thought was wrong and I was really annoyed about it and I called up and the guy who dealt with it.

Walk me. He was really calm. Very friendly, very empathetic walk me through it and then showed me actually at the end that it actually was my fault. What’s that actually my fault, but the way he did it in the end, I was like, oh my goodness, you’re correct. I’m really! Sorry, it’s actually. My fault and I was, and I had started off pretty angry and I’d. Actually, you know maybe being a little less class and denied to say.

Listen, I’m really sorry for snapping at your beginning. I didn’t understand, and I thought I thought you guys were in the wrong. It was actually me and after that I said, what’s your name, he gave me his name and I went immediately and sent a message to his. Yes, exactly snap, so I mean I sent a message because I was like: oh, my goodness, this guy handled that brilliantly he handled it fantastically yeah, but those are four G between typically whether the right or wrong in by the way.

Let’s say they are right. How do we react to respond to customers, even if I know you’re all grace? Yes, you know I have to say. I totally understand how you feel and I would probably feel the same way. I saw it, but you know quite honestly, let me walk you through the process and then let’s reevaluate, where we are and because I want you to be a customer I really did and and so I think that if you’re dealing with people, here’s the other thing, That’s a self professional if you’re going to start a relationship with a new customer here would be my advice.

You tell them. I want you to know John right up front that I will let you down at some point and you know that’s not my hope. It’s not my desire, but I mean human and by me it should be the business, it could be the deliverables, but I will let you down. The difference is, is that you will have my mobile number. You can call me 24/7 and I’m going to solve your problem and I’m going to take accountability as well as responsibility when something happens, because that’s the difference because everybody tries to be like we’re better than them, we’re all you’re, not that special, yeah and and so Tell me a little bit about how so, as you said earlier, so we’re in the situation towards the end of the year.

People are, you know, they’re getting ready for vacations or they’re in parts of the world. Like you know, it’s Ireland’s, the same as like South African that you know you won’t get anything after mid December right people are just switched off, so if you’re, if you’re selling and it’s Thanksgiving or whatever and people are your prospects are going well, you know, let’s Just pick this up in the new year, you know what are some of the ways you can help to make it more urgent that they address the issue this year and they kind of give you a little space.

Well, ironically, we say it’s one of them that people disengage and November all the way through the end of December, because that means they’re not getting hounded by every other salesperson has given up yeah. I see a better window to actually talk to people because in thir maker chances are they work. You know what I might call CEOs in the morning before 8:00 and then in the evening after 8:00. That’s when I reach out – and I coach as CEO of a publicly-traded company and he’s actually just sent me a text before our called said.

Let’s talk tonight at 8:30 Friday, night 8:30. That’s when I got ta talk to her right and, and you have to get into any salesperson – that tells me oh no, after 5:00 is my time. That’s cool enjoy being broke, because this is a different time. Now it’s connected world and you have to be available. They hate you for that, but that’s the truth and yeah. So it should be your question: how do you do that? Well, number one ask you know and if you’re from overseas awesome so call you until I get a restraining order and I’m going to constantly follow up and one of the things that I recommend even an email or voicemail say John.

I try to reach. You can get you, I know you’re busy. I don’t hear back from you. I assume you want me to follow up next Monday and I can show you. I have a guy for 14 months that I did that with and he finally got back with me and he said first, I want you to know. Thank you. I appreciate your due diligence. Second of all, he said it wasn’t you. It really was me, and this is what was going on I’m ready to to me and that’s important.

I have I’ll give you one more job. I want to show you something here. I wan na be careful, you don’t see his name, but this is a CEO that I’m retained. By that you can see the Blues. I think anyway, right that you, hopefully you can get all the best time he’s texted me back, it is was August 26. Was the last time that he texted me back, but I text him tried to reach out here’s the update. He pays me everybody, it’s my responsibility as a salesperson to and now you to give to follow up, and do it not to say well, it’s busy as the end of the year.

You need to call your clients and set it up. Give them that sense of urgency and do it with great. You can’t go in there and be bossy. You have to be subservient, we are but kissers, that’s what sells people are and if you can’t do it don’t do it don’t do the crime, it’s fun yeah. It’s so funny what you just said: they’re back! If you don’t answer this, I presume you want me to follow up Nick, because I get these all the time where I get like three in a row and the third one is seeing, as you haven’t answered.

My last two emails: this is a lot, I’m not going to bother you anymore and I’m like great thanks, but it’s completely the opposite approach. Right call, other people I was actually in cops. Where were we? We were in Charleston South Carolina two weeks ago. These guys Raley guys – and I I want to say, sick, but it’s like this sales process. I’ve ever seen they have a they. Have this young lady, that’s out on the street with a little club dressed up and she’s in a princess outfit.

You know samples of soap and they were selling like so like handmade so different. The other thing she’s enjoy free samples. So so my daughter’s, like oh I’d, love to have some so she’s. All that’s awesome. She make them in house, that’s what, if she’s not might get greasy on your head, why don’t you come in and we’ll wrap it in Mysore box? You take back to the hotel, so this plan. Even me, I’m like it’s really nice and he’s just really guys tours like hey, I need, or they start showing me like the skin care stuff.

Everything by the way was seven hundred and fifty dollars beautiful. It’s working, obviously a target of princes. Given me a free sample, so looking at Israel for the answer and if you’re willing to push through – and you have that confidence, why do I want to be? I want to meet with you for going to pitch me. You want to any value. You want to connect, call me up, let’s meet yeah and by the way I love because we’re bumping up against the end here, but I love that idea of the fact is that yet, there’s probably all around the world and certainly you’re around the states, as probably Salespeople who are giving up saying, oh I’m, never going to get through to Brian.

At this stage you know Thanksgiving is coming up or whatever, and the one piece of advice is to those motivated people listening or reading is yeah they’re clearing the field for you. If you keep you keep trying to talk to you keep trying to get to Brian because of all these other people who’ve quit. You know, guess what you’ve just got a far better chance of being heard. Yeah before I even responded to there, you go we’re pretty well.

Have you did you check your bank account since we started talking so listen Brian? This has been great. Thank you for the insight before we go. If you want to tell people a little bit more about yourself from what you do, that’ll be great. Well, I’m probably the worst myself, but I will say this Brian parsley, which is my website. You can subscribe and I send out a freaking you every week, usually they’re couple minutes all ideas, best practices, all based around sales and customer service.

Excellent. My name is John golden says. Pop online says magazine, pipeliner CRM Brian. This has been fantastic. Hopefully you come back and we’ll talk again soon, love the conversation and see y’all again soon. Thank you.

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Tags best sales advice, Brian Parsley, how to sell, John Golden, sales motivation, sales professional interview, sales professional skills, sales speaker, sales success, sales training, SalesPOP!, Storytelling For Sales Success, top sales tips

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Neuromarketing and Sales with Patrick Renvoise | Sales Expert Insight Series

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date June 1, 2020
No Comments on Neuromarketing and Sales with Patrick Renvoise | Sales Expert Insight Series

My name is John golden from sails pop online says magazine, I’m pipeliner CRM and today I’m joined by Patrick wen Hua’s, a who is the author of the upcoming book, the persuasion code and your marketing can help you persuade anyone anywhere anytime. So welcome Patrick hey good afternoon John, so Patrick, you have been talking about neural marketing and you have you know you ordered another book before and you’ve been in this in this area.

You know for a long long time, so tell me a little bit about what is what is different about your book. That’s coming out in September, the the persuasion code. So what happened is about 17 years ago there was a new branch of marketing that was born called neural marketing, and here is the promise of newer marketing. The promise is that traditional marketing does not really work. Why? Because in traditional marketing, here is what we do.

We ask people: what do you want and then based on their answers? We won’t build a product and later we will create a strategy to sell that part, but the reality is that people don’t really know what they want. As a result, traditional marketing is very often detailing, and the promise of newer marketing was very different. The promise of newer marketing is that we would ask people what do you want, but we will not trust their self-reported answers.

Instead, we could measure directly on their bodies, values, physiological changes that indicate what people truly want so 17 years ago, the world was on fire when people started to use this, because the promise was just too good to be true, and so, if you fast forward 17 Years later, neural marketing has exploded in order today there are over a hundred companies in the world that offered various kinds of services around the home marketing, but it has not really delivered on its initial promise and it has not initially delivered why? Because there is not a single unifying model that explains what you find when you do these physiological measurements.

No word anybody can do various kinds of physiological measurements and by the way, those techniques go from very simple, very inexpensive ones. Where you can measure, for example, the eg on the head of people or you can in measure their emotion based on how to contract the 43 muscles on their faces, or you can measure how their skin changes react resistance. So all these measurements are very easy to do, but what’s really hard is how do you interpret them in a complete? You know sales and marketing approach.

In other words, how should an advertiser change its sales and marketing strategies based on those measurements? So, unfortunately, the initial promise of no marketing has not really delivered. So when we wrote our first book, we suggested that there might be a model that helps you guide everything you do not read them to make it really effective, but we had not tied all that model to all these measurements.

So, what’s continued in our new book is that we are now explaining how it really works, in other words, it’s a little bit like if you are talking about physics. As you know, in physics we are trying to unify the two basic physics model: the traditional physics, bye, doc, bye I’ll help me with his name. It was a British guys, future new Neutron, you use it and the quantum physics. So there is not a single unifying model yet, but we’re getting closer and closer well, there is no single unifying model of sales of marketing and our model, we believe, is their very first one.

That just does that. You know it’s a complete model that explains how people use their brain to make buying decisions and based on that, it helps any entrepreneur. Anybody who has to convince other people about what they need to do if they want to be more successful in sales and marketing. Right so so explain to the people, their listeners, who may not have come across this before or not really pay too much attention.

But why is it that you can’t trust what people initially say they want, or why is it that that neuroscience plays such a big role in really understanding what you know how people make decisions as opposed to what they say sure well think about it. If I ask you, imagine you walk in the restaurant and instead of offering you a menu, I ask you: what do you want to eat tonight? You see how embarrassing how difficult it is to figure out what you really want mm-hmm, whereas if you see that many of you, oh yeah, the chicken looks really good on the menu today.

So when people have to self-report what they really want or what they really like, they are going through the funnel of expressing with words what they want, and that does not allow them to really access the unconscious. As you know, in the mind, if you think about it, there is really a conscious part, which is only five to ten percent of who we are. And then there is this big iceberg underneath it, which is 90 percent of we are, and we really have access to that unconscious and asking people to access that unconscious.

By using words, you know, self-reported words is mission impossible. So the reality is people who really know what they want. However, our body does so, for example, when you get scared, you know you get the first signs of fear even before you’re aware that you’re scared, and today there are a number of tools that we can use to make those measurements. So, in essence, those measurements are allowing us to poke into the unconscious of people, and the techniques are very reliable in the past they used to be very complicated.

In other words, you needed a supercomputer, you needed 10 PhDs to run it and a big budget. Today, all these techniques admitted you know very affordable. In fact, some of these techniques are even accessible for free on the web. So how would you if you take this over the sales for a moment right, so you know sales people have to ask a lot of questions and do discovery and really try and uncover what somebody what a prospect is looking for.

So how does it play into that because, like you said I mean, maybe this is a difficult process for the actual customer. Yes, so in the case of myself, it way now is, if you take that idea and put it in the context of a one-on-one meeting between the buyer and a seller, I mean that what the very first task are the seller is really to understand what are Some of the negative thoughts that are going into the mind of the buyer, I mean in our book.

We call that the pain mm-hmm, but the unconscious pain we believe, are more important than the conscious pains and I’m going to give you an example right now. Imagine the seller is selling home, delivered pizza and the buyer is the average consumer of pizza mm-hmm, most people when you ask them. So what do you work when it comes to a pizza? You know people can talk about, they will tell you. I want extra pepperoni and I want cheese etc, but in reality there is a small company in the u.

S. That figured this out. But four years ago they figured out that not one pain of people buy home. Deliver pizza. I know almost like the unconscious pain. Is the anxiety of not knowing when the pizza will arrive right and again, it would be almost. It would be impossible for most people toward that, but we can measure it on a bun and figuring this out that no pizza shop came up with a slogan and never struggle.

It was 30 minutes or less for extreme mm-hm, and that little place is now known. As Domino’s Pizza – and they became number one now W speaking number one, not because they make the best pizza but because they were able to diagnose that pain and then they build a complete organization whose unique purpose is to eliminate that. So this is the case of Domino’s, going back to our case of a single one on one person selling the job of the sales guy is to read between the line of the answers that the person will that the person will given, but so, if I am That person trying to sell you, Domino’s Pizza, I’m going to ask you questions about, so you know you’re going to be home alone tonight.

What are some of the thoughts that go through your brain etc? And I’m going to try to force you to admit that you have this unconscious pain, but, as you can imagine, it’s a very difficult job. In other words, it’s a job which is more the job of a psychologist than it is the job of a salesperson, and that’s why salespeople typically, are not very good at doing this, because we train ourselves people to be good talkers.

Unfortunately, most of them are not good listeners and to throw a good diagnostic of that pain to find between the line where the consumer really wants. It takes somebody who has the capacity to listen very deeply, and it takes the capacity of people can ask the right questions and and a prospect or a customer. It’s one of the value drivers will reward you for uncovering something. You know a problem or a pain that they either didn’t know they had or did not weren’t aware that it was that acute right.

So that’s really where you logged in yeah, when you do that diagnostic of the pain properly there are two major benefit. The first benefit is it’s a soft way of selling. You know where you don’t have to say: well, we have the best product, I’m the best sales guy, no you’re, demonstrating your expertise, not by what you say, but by what you ask for by the quality of the questioning that you drive. So that’s the first thing.

The second thing is asking question: is the best way to develop rapport right, if you think about it, the people that are interesting, a lot of people that talk about himself. There are the people that talk to you about you. So, what’s the best way for me to talk to you about you, if you ask you question and so and so getting back, pivoting back a little to the neuro marketing piece. So when you look at at most companies marketing today say software products or whatever.

What do you see is the big problem with the kind of traditional marketing and how could people flip that using newer marketing? Well, the problem is that marketing well done typically is very expensive. I mean you need to do big surveys. You need to question a lot of people, so I think a lot of people think of marketing as an expensive task, but when I think about it, for us, Noora marketing is really what can help people differentiate between the what people think they want and what people Really want inside the unconscious and for a large company.

This is invaluable. You know I’ll give you just one example: we’re working for Avon, for example, and you know trying some of our techniques they’ve been able to see sales increase by up to 40 % for some of the shampoo products, because a lot of the ads that they were Doing were too focused on the product itself, etc, but it was not really addressing some of the core pains or negative emotion that resides in the brain of our consumers right.

So that is really the promise of no marketing it’s to help. People do focus everything. They talked about which typically centered on the mimimi, I mean most people, if you think about it most people when they talk about the products and services they talk about who they are and what they do, mm-hmm. In fact, if you look at all websites, most websites include a tab which is called who we are and another tab, which is called what we do, but the critical information that is missing there is: why should the customer buy right, and what we have seen is That noir marketing is the fastest surest way to get companies to quickly focus and now down on why the customer should buy.

So what are some other examples that you’ve seen of where somebody has done this? Well, where they’ve changed their marketing approach and and really hit the you know, hit the target. You know there are no many examples, but if you’re talking about Apple, for example, right the computer and phone company Steve Jobs by the way used to say we don’t do marketing at Apple, because the consumer doesn’t know – and I know better than them what they want.

So we’re going to build it if you’re, not in fact not completely wrong, we’re going to sell a lot of it, but Apple has been the champion of this now think about it. I’d like to take you back about 30 years ago. Why would people want to buy an Apple computer thirty years ago? There was only one reason think about 30 years ago. Yes, the reason is slightly different today. That’s why I’m bringing you back a few years back? Why would people buy a Macintosh when the main computer? Well, the main competitor at the time was the regular PC at the time they it was very specialized.

I mean there were people, maybe actually yes, designers and people like that who bought Max’s right and a few students. You know what was the main reason. Why? Because it was easier to use, you know what, if you were buying your PC, he didn’t have a degree in computer science. It would be very hard for you to use it right, so Macintosh make it easier for people so Apple use. That claim, in other words, the reason why you would want to buy your Apple computer years and years ago, was easier to use and slowly over time as computers became easier to use Apple to endorse another crime, and why would people buy an iPhone today? There’s still only one reason, but it’s slightly different.

It’s no one here to use because every four years is to use – and you know what it is: it’s cool to use cool yeah. So this again so Apple decided once and for all in the 35 year history. They went from a t1 claim, is it to use and they slowly switch to cool to use over a period of time, but they did that because they know that had been one crime. You know being able to write the book. Why buy enough? On the only one chapter mm-hm and hammering that chapter you know cause when Apple’s 20 years ago was selling a mirror.

It was always you know easy to use by creating that repetition by making it clear as to what is that one chapter in the book title? Why buy an Apple Apple has been extremely extremely successful, so Apple was using some of the concept that we are now explaining from a purely scientific standpoint for for many many years right so, but so basically BAM based on that, then, are you saying that most companies Should really look at uncovering that that one or two reasons, real reasons why a customers should buy from them absolute and it an it, and as you say, it’s not the obvious one in terms of it may not be they the product itself.

It may be something you know totally tangental even to it right absolutely I mean, if you think about it, easy to use and a Macintosh computer. It has nothing to do fast. Delivery has nothing to do with the pizza itself. In other words, unfortunately, if you’re selling your commodity, you will not be able to find what makes you unique in the product itself, because, by definition it’s a commodity, so you’ve got to find that one reason why people want to buy it and it’s going to be Outside of the product, functions and features itself, and all the companies that are successful have destroyed it for a long long time.

That’s excellent advice so before we finish up today, give me a little bit more information about when your book is available about your company about yourself and how people can learn more about you right. So our first book is the valuable you know it was written about. Fifteen years ago, so it’s still available. Our new book titled, the persuasion code, will be available in mid September, is published by ye, and the information is already available on amazon.

Com and what we are is we are the only advertising agency in the world that uses no marketing techniques to diagnose the pain of The customer and ours fine, the true motivation that drives people to buy. Then we are a strategic, consulting firm. We guide the choice of companies on what is that one chapter in your book and we train people on all these concepts and the last thing we do is we have a small, creative arm.

Then, once we have agreed on all this concept, they actually rhyme. So the concepts are, what are the pains in the brain of your customers, and how do you diagnose that then? The second concept is: how do you differentiate your claims numbers? How do you make your solution appear completely unique in the eyes of your customers, even if you’re selling commodity, we call that the claims? The third concept is, how do you demonstrate the game? No, it’s not enough to say I have the best product.

How do you actually prove it and how the volume so pain claim and gain, and the last step is: how do you deliver to the primal brain? In other words, how do you deliver your message to the unconscious of the consumer? Okay, so we packages we package, our services, so that small companies and not company alike, can see benefit in applying a model that is again completely anchored in the science of the human right.

Yeah, it’s fascinating stuff and I’ve had the pleasure of seeing Patrick speak before so I would highly recommend that you, you check out the sales brain and check out Patrick and check out his book and I think you’ll find it extremely fascinating. So listen thanks again, Patrick for joining us. Today. We look forward to to your book and to seen the model in you know its glory coming out in September and then learning more about this fascinating subject.

So thank you for joining us today. My name is John Gould and sales pop online says magazine. Pipeliner CRM will see all for another expert inside interview really soon. Thank you, John. So I encourage you to subscribe to sales pop dotnet. The online sales magazine also subscribe to our You, Tube blog and then comment get involved in the conversation, love to hear what you have to say.

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Tags best sales advice, branch of marketing called neuromarketing, foundation of marketing, John Golden, marketing and sales, Neuromarketing and Sales, Patrick Renvoise, sales and marketing tips, Sales Expert Insight, Sales Expert Insight Series, sales professional interview, sales professional skills, sales speaker, sales training, SalesPOP!, top sales tips

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Reveals the Persuasion Code with Patrick Renvoise | Sales Expert Insights

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date May 31, 2020
No Comments on Reveals the Persuasion Code with Patrick Renvoise | Sales Expert Insights

My name is John golden from says pop online says magazine and pipeliner CRM, and today I’m joined again by Patrick Renoir, say how you doing Patrick very good. Thank you. How are you excellent and Patrick’s new book has just come out – hit hit the bookshelves Amazon everywhere the persuasion code? How neuromarketing can help you persuade anyone anytime anywhere anywhere anytime and Patrick yeah? You wrote your first book 16 years ago and, as we were saying just before we came on air you’ve been kind of writing.

You and your cohorts been kind of writing this book now follow-up book for 16 years, so how’s it taking so long. Well, it’s taking so long because the very first book I wrote was actually the first book on neuromarketing, so we almost people didn’t even know what new marketing was. We did not invent the word we adopted it. You know the first time we heard it because we felt it was the best explanation of what we were doing but Justin.

You know the amount of things that have come out, that being you in the last 15 years may be overwhelming, and we felt we had to write really a second book. So what are some of the major things that have evolved or changed, or that you’ve discovered in the interim that really made this new book compelling? Well the number of things. But the first thing is when no marketing first started to appear.

The promise was just almost too good to be true, in other words, people have known for a long time that marketing does not really work, because marketing is about asking people. What do you want and then you base your product development and your sales and marketing strategy and what people have self-reported so because we know people don’t know what they want. You know billions of dollars are wasted on failing marketing campaigns every year, so the promise of normal marketing was that by measuring directly on the body of people, values physiological changes that would we would get a really good indication about what they really want and, as a Result, you know everybody would save money, all marketing campaigns would be way more, effective, etc, but it has not really been delivering opens Provence, and one of the reason is that it’s very easy to get update.

I know what you can put electrodes on the head of people can ask them question: you can make these physiological measurements, but how do you interpret those and how do you actually deliver marketing insights that generate results? This is more complicated than what people originally thought and in Tooker’s, or you know about fifteen years, to realize that without an interpretation model, people do not really see the benefits of no marketing and that’s the subject of our second book.

We say yes, no marketing is great. We can measure all these things, but do not expect to get miracle results, especially if you’re not using a predictive model, and you know our second book addresses this issue, and it also gives a complete scientific picture of the model that we first published sixteen years ago. So so now we go an emotional level of detail about justifying, for example, yeah I’ll.

Just give you one example upon me that you’re, why do stories work when you’re in sales? Why do beach bar pictures more effective than text? So we simple yet scientific explanation about all the things that a lot of people were doing intuitively in the past, but they didn’t know where they were working mm-hmm. So let’s talk a little bit about that. Maybe I’d learn it a little bit more about the the model and and how you can actually start to measure and interpret these things.

Sure so, first of all, model is based on the work of Daniel Kahneman was the winner of the economy, Nobel Prize in 2002. More recently, in 2017, one of his students, guy by the name of Richard Taylor, also won the economy Nobel Prize, and you went further in this. So we’ve based our model on the work of these people and here is the fundamental discoveries that they’ve made, which is that we have two personalities if you want in other word, you know where everybody has multiple personality disorder and there is the rational us, and there Is the primal us Kahneman called it system, one for the primal us unconscious brains, the brain that helps you? You know deal with digestion, breathing a low-level body function and then, on top of that, you have a much more evolved brain called the brain and he called that system too.

And although we think that we make decision using our smart brain in reality, the impact of our primal brain on the rational brain is greater than the impact of the rational brain on the karmic way. So what we have done is we have studied in you know, for about 20 years now the working principles of that primal brain and because that primal brain by definition is ancient. You know we share that brain with very primitive forms of lives like reptiles, because that brain is so ancient and internet did not exist back then that brain can only be triggered by one of six stimuli.

So we teach people how this human eye works and our expertise is in translating those sixteen I into what people should do in sales marking and further than the stimuli. We have translated those stimuli into four steps that everybody should master, go ahead. No, I’m just going to ask you so so what you? What you’re saying is so, as you said, I mean we believe, because we all believe that we’re very highly sophisticated people that you know all the decisions we made.

You know we rationalize them and all of that kind of stuff, but what you’re saying is: there’s a it’s a lot more primal. How we do it may be our physiologically reactive things. I mean that actually is a much bigger driver of our decision-making process. Is that right, yeah, that’s correct! In fact, Antonio Damasio was when one of the world expert on the role of emotion of the brandy said we are not thinking machines that feel we are feeling machines that think so all of the emotions you know they win over.

All the rational aspect of our decision-making and even further than the emotion the issue of survival is key to all the decisions we make. The only thing is we’re not even aware of it but you’ll take prize. For example, I mean everybody right now, he’s happy to pay five dollars and get a cup of coffee at Starbucks. That mean stuff is pretty naira. However, if Starbuck was going to put the price of coffee at twenty dollars, people would start to hesitate to buy a coffee there.

Why? Because they know that he’s they spend too much money on their cup of coffee. They might not have enough money to pay the rent which down the road is the modern version of survival. So again, all these have all these phenomenons happen at the level of our unconscious, but they have biological manifestation, which are undeniable. You know if you look at even the most primitive forms of life. Primitive forms of life respond with the fight or flight syndrome, or the approach or with drugs in the first form of life is a unicellular.

And if you take a unicellular here and you put a drop of sugar close to it, that unicellular will be drawn to the sugar, because it’s a source of energy, so that unicellular will do everything he can to move closer to that stimulus of the sugar. Now take the same unicellular and drop a drop of acid close to it or you know them juice and that mini cylinder will move the way. Well, we even being still operate the same way.

You know, if you put in front of my nose a very desirable item, like the you know, the latest iPhone or the latest Nexus subscription or whatever my natural tendency will be. I will be drawn towards it and, of course it’s the job of Apple. If I buy the iPhone to create that positive emotion that draws me towards it, but those two meters that are created by companies that are trying to sell you something fundamentally, they operate at the same level as the phenomenon that happens in the unicellular.

It’s all about the biology of the equation yeah, it’s very interesting because I was just thinking cuz when I was having this conversation with some of the other day, and it always fascinates me one of the biggest purchases people make in their lives is a home right And yet think of the buying process for most people you go around, you look at a few houses and then you decide one because you get a feeling from it and you maybe only spend like 20 minutes in the place and next minute, you’re already you’re putting In bids and everything and – and you spend more time, as you say, probably deciding, will I get the iPhone S or X or whatever? Then you you something very interesting, you said you have the feeling that some things happen, but for most people guess what they don’t.

Even experience that feeling in others that feeling stays below the level of consciousness and at the end of the day, they might decide that they, like this house, because that house, at the exact same smell that the cookies that the grandmother cooked years ago mm-hmm, which is Why it’s a good tip for people is to always bake cookies before people come to look at your house, it’s a guess and they make sure the house is warm and they make sure you know that the light is on.

They make sure that the house is staged, so yeah absolutely right to show us what happens in Damacio said that he said we make emotional decisions and then we rationalize nice, but not vice versa. And again, I know you would take me a little longer than discussion, but we have all the scientific proof that this is undeniable. So what is it that most day, what would you be your advice? Obviously, you know get the book and read it, but what would be your advice to people who are looking at their marketing today? How can they tell whether they are movie, whether they are able to do what you’re describing here or whether they’re completely missing the mark and well yeah? I could give you tons of examples, but so this, the 16i, are very precise.

In our presentation I mean one of the stimuli is the concept of visual again. This is nothing new, because we all know that picture is worth a thousand words, but the you know the brain is mostly visual. People say that about 80 % of all brain activity is about processing images. By the way, if you look at the opposite of visual in terms of conceptual data, it would be text right. No, if I want to tell you about the concept of a cat, I can either show you a cat, or I can tell you the word cat.

The third way to communicate the concept of cat would be to hand you a cat, so people learn in three ways: it’s called visual auditory kinesthetic. We have three blogs for learning now most companies today when they communicate the value prop. They do it using words when you wrote our website and you see a long explanation about what they do. Well, unfortunately, that primal brain is mostly visual.

So what that mean? I’m not suggesting that you need to visual the product, but you need to come up with a visual that becomes a symbolic representation of the value proposition. So, for example, if I sell a really very complicated software solution to you know a large industrial organization and one part of my value proposition is it will save you money, then the concept of saving money? How can I represent that, so I may use a picture of a safe.

I may use a picture of a banknote, but that’s what I mean by this. You know being able to go the next step. I could say it saves you money, I’m using text. There is no emotion in it or I can actually show you a picture of a banknote. Give you another example. If the core of your value proposition is easy. Well, I can talk about easy all day long or I can show you a picture of the easy button from Staples or if your value drop is one-stop shopping.

I could use those. We saw me nice because the Swiss Army knife, you know, becomes the symbol of the screwdriver, the core corner and the plate. So going one step beyond the simple value pub that uses normally word using a visual escape. So that’s that’s one thing. Another concept would be you know today. Most people talk about the fact that they are a leading provider. Are the problem? Is all your competitors are saying the same thing so that does not trigger that primal brain? Because one of the similarities contrast, you know, the primal brain is any contrast to see that all the other guys do this, but you only only one will do that.

Now, of course, it’s easy to say, but if you have a commodity, how do you create that uniqueness and we didn’t run to people that they have to scratch their head? They have to find that uniqueness at all cost, to increase the amount of contrast so that your customers see all the other solution as the green apple and then suddenly, you become only write up and that only red apple is what triggers the decision of people yeah.

It’s it’s interesting because, as you say, I mean the you know, the perception at least in most buyers of the most products and services are highly commoditized today right and that they’re easily. So you can easily walk from one to the other and there’s no big big deal. So I see where you’re, today, more than ever, that concept of finding something that stands out for you is absolutely critical and what you’re saying there is it’s the only way you’re going to elevate yourself or catch anyone’s attention, otherwise, you’re going to stay in the in The swappable well imagine you’re selling water, and you have two competitors are selling similar water.

Then your probability to win the deal is only going to be one third. So if you want to go beyond that simple probability, you’ve got to find a way to say what’s different about your water mm-hmm and most people again when they are in the commodity business. Most people shy away from doing it because they are looking for the differentiation in the product itself and you won’t find it because by definition, it’s a commodity.

So you’ve got to find a way to say that you will deliver on the water for free or you will do you know your packaging is recyclable or you’re. The greenest provider of you know water or whatever and amazingly enough, regardless of if that differentiation, that uniqueness does not belong to the product, it will still create enough appeal in the brain of a customer that they might decide to buy from you.

So one of the things you say in in in the in in the material surrounding your book is obviously when somebody approaches it first and goes neuromarketing. Oh that sounds very complex. I don’t know if I could do that, but you’re saying that it. Actually, you have been able to make this simple, where people can actually understand how to do it and actually deliver it yeah. In fact, I think we made a big mistake when we named our first book neuromarketing that the subtitle was understanding the back button inside your customers brain.

We assumed that people would understand what no marketing means. So in our second book we decided that is not the right title and that’s why we named our second book, the persuasion code and it’s really about understanding how people used our brain to make buying decisions. And it’s really about not only using science but simplifying that science. You know Kahneman the guy one, that you’re kind of mean normal price I just mentioned was a very feller.

The only problem is he didn’t make his knowledge very accessible in all. His book is pH D plus plus level reading, and I had to read his book of course many times and most people that have opened up his book. They gave up after 30 percent of the book just because it’s so complicated, so a big part of our job. In connecting that making that connection between the world of neural, you know, researchers on the brain and the world of marketing was to simplify the equation.

In fact, what we found was the most difficult in that simplification was to make it visual. In other words, if you look at our book, we have one poster at the beginning of the book, which summarizes everything and for us to be able to come up with the right visual metaphor, to explain what we do. It took us a long long time. You know it’s a little bit like the teachers that we had at school right.

You could have a very, very smart teacher if he cannot make his knowledge accessible, everybody hates him, and nobody is good in any subject and the teacher that could make their knowledge more accessible, regardless of the complexity of the concept that they were teaching. They are the one that are really helpful, yeah ya know cuz. I remember one teacher from when I was very, very small and he used to draw little stupid little pictures in chalk and on the board.

You know and illustrate everything with these ridiculous little stick figures and doing stupid things. Everybody remembered everybody knew what he was talking about and you know why, because at that moment it is more appealing for the primal brain of the audience. Then the neocortex then the rational, when in fact I don’t know if your listeners can see the camera, but this is our old poster, so we know poster you know we had a stop point and we had an end point and that end point was the bite.

But another – and you know second book now: we’ve rendered the whole thing a little bit more sophisticated and we’re using a completely different metaphor. In fact, it’s a more scientific metaphor that we’re using excellent ok. So in the last couple of minutes, Patrick, is there anything else? You’d like to highlight about the book well, and just maybe I relate the book to what’s happening today in the news.

As you know, a lot of people are concerned about what Russia and China are doing, and you know a book is releasing the exact date of the book. Release is September 19th and will receive an order from China from the Chinese publisher. We already bought 5,000 copies of the book, and the second country that bought a book was Russia, so on one hand I’m very excited because it’s good for us. On the other hand, I am very concerned because it’s probably the last people I would wish they would know about that – sign they’re already really good, but I am worried about knowledge.

Well, I think the only way to to counteract that is for lots of people in Europe and America to buy it too. I mean you know when, when you understand how market ears are trying to influence your decision, then you can start to protect yourself. If you know against how people influence you, in fact, as a professional in that field, I am always questioning myself when I want to buy something. I’m going.

Okay, I’m mind buying it because the message was very good or I might buy it because it’s really going to help my life and sometimes I can say no, I don’t want it because I don’t need it sometimes, when the message is that good? Well, I still buy that ice cream. Although I really know it’s bad for me. Well, everybody needs a little bit of ice cream again. Well, listen! Patrick again! The book is the persuasion code.

How neuromarketing can help you persuade anyone anywhere anytime available on all the online booksellers it’ll be in the sales pop bookstore as well, and the release date is, as you said, September 18th. I think yes excellent, so I really encourage you to go out and if you get a chance to listen to Patrick speak he’s an excellent speaker too. So thank you very much for for joining us today, Patrick thank you and you have a good day yeah.

Thank you. This John golden says pop online says magazine. Pipeliner CRM see all again for an expert interview really soon, so I encourage you to subscribe to sales pop dotnet. The online sales magazine also subscribe to our YouTube blog and then comment get involved. In the conversation. Love to hear what you have to say:

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Tags best sales advice, how to sell, John Golden, Patrick Renvoise, Reveals the Persuasion Cod, sales motivation, sales professional interview, sales professional skills, sales speaker, sales training, SalesPOP!, top sales tips

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Effective Sales Communication and Sales Skills with Catherine Molloy

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date May 29, 2020
No Comments on Effective Sales Communication and Sales Skills with Catherine Molloy

My name is John golden from sails pop online sales magazine and pipeliner CRM here in a lovely sunny San Diego afternoon and I’m delighted to be joined by Catherine Malloy, who was on the Sunshine Coast in Australia. Tomorrow, I’m here Thursday afternoon, Catherine’s there, Friday morning, bright and early. So I really appreciate you getting up early to talk with us today: Catherine’s international speaker and communication expert, 25 years of experience in business training and facilitation, and especially in especially in communication and neuro-linguistic programming.

I think you have your degree in as well as obviously all your business experience and what we wanted to talk today is how to optimize communication when it comes to sales, but not just in the traditional sense of face-to-face, but in all the ways that challenge salespeople Nowadays, in virtual communication, even in I mean people says, people in are communicating with prospects through text. We’re going to say excel mean what about what challenges are facing people today in figuring out how to be effective in their communication, when people are communicating in so many different ways.

Catherine, I always like to ask a big question and then just sit back. You know it’s really important. We all need to upgrade the number one skill on the planet and that’s communication, and so many businesses closed down because they don’t really know how to communicate to the customer. Now. The interesting thing is, technology has changed the way we grow food eat food, buy food, our furniture for our offices, all these wonderful things, but guess what the raw behavior styles of people haven’t changed, and I think this is the key to the way that we build Sales now I actually wrote a book called the million dollar handshake.

It’s just been published in three languages. It only was really. Last year, it’s in the northern and southern hemisphere. We’ve just picked up some books from England, they’ve released them under Seven Dials. We’ve got hash. Ed we’ve got two other companies releasing them around the world as well, and it really is about the way that we can make ourselves feel a million dollars. The way that we can make our customers feel great and create that win-win situation.

So when you say interesting thing is when, when you say, rob raw behavior style, what do you mean? Okay, so I’ve got a quote here that I wrote. What you believe doesn’t make you a better person mm-hmm. The way you behave does sure, because what we believe isn’t always right now we have natural behavior styles. I can connect and communicate with anyone anywhere. I went to China and within two days how to contract I’ve been back there every year to speak for the translators Association in the foreign ministers.

Now everyone says it’s very, very hard to get a deal in China takes a long time. I’ve worked in Saudi Arabia, UAE lots of countries that you know it’s. It’s got a lot of different culture, ruler aspects that we need to know about, so it really is about being intelligent when it comes to communication, so we do need to you know. What are you doing to upgrade your number-one skills in communication and I’m a body language expert, and I truly believe this is why I get better results with what I do so we need to study.

We need to learn. We need to immerse ourselves in communication and when we understand behavior styles, whether that person is dominant, are they breathing fast? Are they commanding whether they’re influential and they want you to be their best friend? They want you to like them. They want to tell you everything. That’s happening or whether perhaps are a little bit more steady and they need to build that relationship with you, so hopeful they’re going to give you anything.

So how can I go on last but not least, they might be the person that really wants all the facts and figures before anything is going to happen. Now you have a natural way that you want to do business yeah, but that might not suit the other. 75 % of people mm-hmm, so once you start to understand how you can connect and communicate, we can also do this through our emails, our social media, etc, but we’ll get into that in a little bit.

Sorry, what was the first question was, so how does a salesperson or anyone else? How did they establish there very quickly or early on the type of person they’re dealing with and the Preferences that that person has for how they want to be communicated with fabulous? It’s about being conscious. The first thing you need to do, though, is understand your behavior style. You need to understand your domino effect in every communication that you have, and you know it’s interesting because body language is in every communication experience you’ll ever have even when you’re typing that email you’re going to have a certain body language coming through, even when you’re speaking Even right now, when we’re speaking to each other or when we meet someone face to face, so we’ve got to start to understand who we are and even in in my book here I have a PDF, you can download, you can fill in or you can fill It in straight from the book and start to understand who you are, how you connecting communicates, what is going to be the best way for you, because, let’s face it, if you have a business, everyone in your business, you want them to be a salesperson for your Team mm-hmm people hate the word sales and we need to get over that.

If you don’t sell, you don’t have a business yeah. Well, what I always say what I would say to people when they have a problem with the whole sales moniker is, I say you can call yourself whatever you want, but guess what the person you’re selling to they know you’re a salesperson. We have to remember that as well, and you know I always think to sell is to serve because if someone comes to you or you go to someone and you don’t provide that service for them, then you haven’t really served them.

Have you know and a lot of people you’ll go and buy something, and then you go home and someone will say: oh, you should have got this or this or you could add that to it. They didn’t even tell you about it. Now you’ve got to waste. Your time going back to fine that what you need and perhaps you’ll go somewhere somewhere else because they didn’t satisfy your needs. So what are what are some of the simple body? Language cues? That you can pick up on the either about yourself or about the person that you’re communicating with okay.

So the first thing I’ll talk about is yourself mm-hmm, okay, very important to understand the cultures you’re going into because body language is different around the world. You know if you did this here in Australia that would be okay or on Facebook. You might like it in India, maybe you’re going to get a 7-up if you’re a scuba, diving – and you said yeah, I’m okay, they’d shoot you to the top. You’d have to do that if you did that in some countries, they’d be very rude and you might get you know put in jail.

So it’s really important number one to understand that, but there’s a few things that we can do that will make a difference anywhere with anyone. So a lot of salespeople you’ll ask them a question or a customer service and they might go like this. Oh yes, do this now straightaway we know they’ve got a pain in the neck and they’re, not really sure, and when somebody does that I go, would you please you know find out for me it’s very very important because I know straightaway they don’t really know mm-hmm.

Now body language is very subjective. If I touch my nose now, it’s probably because it’s freezing, cold and and it wants to drip right – or perhaps I want to sneeze or maybe ever smelt – something really bad. But what’s interesting is most time when salespeople are speaking. They touch their nose because they’re a little frustrated and uncomfortable right now so you’ll see people online, telling you how fantastic their product is it’s true and when they do that, I know at that time: they’re not comfortable with it.

Now I can train people not to touch their face to make great eye contact, not to blink a hundred times, but you know what I rather coach them to understand: why they have a frustration they’re. What makes them uncomfortable mm-hmm and if it’s not great for the customer, what can you do to make it great for the customer, because those frustrations and movements will go away once you have great product knowledge and – and you believe in the benefit to that customer yeah? No, I totally agree with you.

I think it’s an interesting it’s an interesting concept that you brought up there, because I do think that how you present yourself, how you go into a room, how you go online, whatever, how you’re feeling and how you approach it is going to translate in one way Or the other yeah, obviously through nonverbal communications and through and through how you sound and – and so you kind of have to make up your mind before you start about.

How do you want to show up right correct? Absolutely we react in 125th of a second before we speak, and that’s why husbands and wives can fight for two days without saying a word because of the raise of an eyebrow at the wrong time. And this happens in your offices as well, and you might even see a client, you know, and you think, oh here they come again. What am I going to do and straightaway you’ve told them that even before you’ve opened your mouth and that’s why we have so much miscommunication? And you know it’s interesting because when we’re talking about behavior styles, before even in your emails, you can start to tell who the person is.

Are they dot pointing do they want you to do this this and this? Are they, after your facts and figures, do they put Smiley’s everywhere because they want you to be happy with them, you know, or are they going to tell you all about everything and you don’t even really understand what is that question they want right, but it starts To tell you who they are yeah, and I guess then the worst thing you can do right if, for instance, right if you email me with very concise bullet points – and this is what you want and I email you back a novel right, I’m we’re pretty misaligned Right, correct, correct, so it really is about, like I believe, to sell, is to serve and when you do find out who that customer is because they’ll, let you know you’ll hear it in their voice.

You’ll see it online, you might meet them face-to-face or you’ll. Get it through that email, you start to find out who they are and you need to respond, so you need to match them because guess what there’ll be something about you that they like, but they won’t know what it is right. That’s actually the fact that you will like them, people like like: don’t they yeah they do. I was telling someone. I was interviewing somebody of the day and they tell me this this interesting story.

I think they were. They would right, along with the salesperson right and the salesperson, got a text from their prospect and immediately they picked up the phone and started calling them calling the prospect and the prospect was like. Well. Can you just text me back and the coach turned round and said: why did you call him when he texted you clearly that’s how he wanted you to communicate so you’ve got a match: people’s communication style.

You do, and I do believe, though, that someone might email you in asking for information and you, if you just email that back guess what you might lose that deal, because you haven’t been able to speak or add value. So in that text that you send back. You could say: look I’d, love to have a quick chat just to do a discovery and make sure what would be the best time for you so text them, email them back in their format, but think in that time that you can actually do a real discovery.

In that value, no absolutely I no 100 % agree, but don’t presume that you can just switch their mode just like that without any. I remember somebody wanted me and they sent me a message, a message, err and then they sent me something on LinkedIn and then they sent me an email and by the time we were supposed to meet. I had no idea where I had to go to get the information so surprised they didn’t turn up outside your window.

The placard [ Laughter ] in those situations. You know you’re responding, I’m messenger been LinkedIn there. You know it’s like. Oh, let’s agree to to have which is the best form of communication for you, but don’t think just to come back to, because I think it’s it’s a really really fundamental and an important point and not just for sales. But I think in the world that we live in today, because communication has gotten so messed up is that we all have to start with ourselves right.

The onus is on us to to to be conscious of how we communicate and how we show up, and rather than put the rather than as it seems, the trend in the world today is to push everything off on everybody else and say: well, it’s all about Everybody else’s fault, but it’s you got to start with yourself right, absolutely and look the reason that after all these years, we are still such bad communicators, no matter how many forms of communication we create is, I believe, there’s a couple things with human nature and we Understand it once we understand the behavior styles, each one will have their own little basements that we have to work through.

Ah, but there’s a thing called ego, hmm and also laziness, and I believe, when you’re a salesperson, you really want to eradicate those two things – and you know, laziness is just sending out spraying information to everybody. If you’re a salesperson which we all are, we need to have that communication, we need to pick up the phone, we need to ask questions and not just read someone create a story for that person.

Oh, I don’t want to disturb them or they’re too busy. You know one of my biggest clients, I got them as a contact first of all and I get a lot of business through LinkedIn, so it is great out there and I contacted them and they said, Oh fantastic. Can you send, through some information, sent that through months later, did my follow-up are yeah we’re not ready yet you know please get back in contact with us, so I’d I read for six months following up and contact them and then I said because we’ve start to Build a bit of a relationship, I said, I’m so sorry, I’m feeling like a stalker.

Do you still want me to communicate with you? Yes, yes, but that’s that was that person’s behavior style there was Ned eNOS, it’s going to take them a little longer. Thirteen months later, we sealed the deal mm-hmm five hundred thousand dollars worth of training that was ongoing over the next 18 months. So the interesting thing is that we feel we should give up or we could make stories or they don’t really want want this.

But you don’t know unless you ask the question: no make up story that just leaves us. Oh, what can we do? Yeah? No exactly, but it’s a great point, because it’s it’s because people do have a tendency to you know either to give up, and I think the point that you came up about did you meant laziness is a good one. It’s because, unfortunately, again coming back to technology, we’ve spoiled we’re spoiled with all these spray-and-pray spam tools out there.

So I could sit here all day and I can fire out stuff all over the place and if nobody comes back to me or I can just put them into nurture Kanban – and I don’t have to do anything right – I can sit down then I can go Well, I’m trying I’m really trying I’m doing follow-up but nobody’s contacting me. So it’s not my fault again. I’ve got this great little thing that I’d love to share with your listeners yeah, and I call it digger and I believe, if you are a sales person getting paid for Commission, we’re not always the best with admin and paperwork.

So I truly believe setting up the night before so that when you come in the next morning, you can just now those first three things you know, we’ve all heard you know swallow the frog eat the spider, doing the things you don’t really want to do. First up but digger in Australia were the men that went to war and they they had a person with them that helped them get through everything. And you know that was like the word mate and in Australia, and you don’t call anyone a digger even if they they’re your mate, because that was war and, like I lost my grand-grandfather there as well.

But digger for me is daily income generating activity, say that again daily income generating activity, and so that’s my best mate in business. So I write down three things: each day, whether it’s doing the blog, whether it’s doing the article, whether it’s making a hot call, a cold call, maybe getting some of those warm leads. But every day you should be doing something that really will bring in money.

For the business yeah yeah, I think that’s a fantastic piece of advice because I think we’re all very good, sometimes at busy work or finding things to occupy our day and sometimes avoiding the tea. As you say, the digger the daily income generating activities first time because they maybe are the harder things to do yeah yep, and we get that out the way. Then the the day’s amazing plus it starts to unfold.

You know – and it really is, if we want to be successful in business, we need to upgrade that number one skill of communication. Well, that’s fantastic, perfect way to bookend the conversation here, Catherine, we’re bumping up against the end of our time, but before we go I’d like you to tell people a little bit more about yourself what you do and how they can learn, learn more about you! Oh okay, fabulous so obviously Catherine Malloy and I am an international speaker.

I work all around the world and I speak in communication and body language because I really believe in business growth. I wrote the book, the million dollar handshake, because what happened was ten years ago. My husband felt very ill. We had to sell our business, we lost over a million dollars that was tied up in the belly business. We had three children still at a private school and we were then left with a big mortgage on the house.

That also left us with no jobs, so there was a big decision time and I was sort of that person that I thought wow. This is almost a chance to to open the door to what’s possible in life. What do I really really wanted to and back when I was 21, I started studying body language by the age of 22. I was topping sales in Westpac, one of our biggest banks here in Australia, and I really understood how that product knowledge equalled customer service and from customer service sales cloud.

But when you could understand people and not just read body language and make up stories for them. But understand what your body language was communing communicating to others. Then I really started to Nollan and I went into training. I wasn’t having children, my husband said he couldn’t have kids and we had three and four years so that kind of changed everything sounds like you learned plenty, but anyway it was interesting.

So I started this business as pack business advantage and it was really dealing with soft skills. We also had government funding to deliver diploma of leadership management, so I wrote units for that. I won awards in management and leadership of won awards in America with our Stevie. For our sales and leadership training and I also wrote the conscious connection framework, which won a pacific award back in 2017.

So what we’re doing was making a big difference for four people, and so now, we’ve also with our million dollar handshake book, because in my first year of business by myself, I signed over a million dollars in training deals face to face. So that’s how that began. It’s got body language, the handshakes, behaviors mindsets and how to connect and communicate with anyone anywhere taste other’s stories and there’s online training at the end of each chapter.

So if you want to go a bit deeper in any of those you can you can download PDFs for your team for your family. I just really want to get this message out to as many people as possible and now a third of that book goes to our charity that I started in 2010. When I started my business, I said to my husband, ten percents going to charity and he’s like you can’t we’ve lost all this money. I said I need that because for me I need to be doing more than just just for us and now a third of it goes to our charities in Uganda and this year.

We’re writing a book of life worth leading and we’re also working with doctors in Mumbai for cancer patients, children that would actually die because they don’t have money for to treat cancer and now they’re getting 12 months in this amazing hospital being looked after with their families. Coming in so that they can go on with their lives as well, so I think that once we use our skills to the best that we can yeah, we can make a difference anyway.

That’s fantastic! Well there. So it sounds like you’re. You know you’ve got a lot of spare time on your hands, Katherine well, yeah, that’s really! Quite a fantastic, obviously scatter malloy calm, a you. We will have your profile on sales pop, so people can learn more about you and I and the book will be up there too, and congratulations on all your Awards and the fantastic were charity work that you’re doing it’s been a great conversation.

My name is John golden sales. Pop online says magazine, pipeliner CRM, CEO friend, our expert interview really soon. Thank you. Thank you.

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Neuromarketing and Sales with Patrick Renvoise | Sales Expert Insight Series

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date May 27, 2020
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Tags best sales advice, branch of marketing called neuromarketing, foundation of marketing, John Golden, marketing and sales, Neuromarketing and Sales, Patrick Renvoise, sales and marketing tips, Sales Expert Insight, Sales Expert Insight Series, sales professional interview, sales professional skills, sales speaker, sales training, SalesPOP!, top sales tips

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Concept of Syntegration in Sales | Professor Fredmund Malik

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date May 26, 2020
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Gallen in Switzerland. How you doing I’m doing very well? How are you doing? Thank you for inviting me for this collegial talk yeah, absolutely and for those of you who want to wear.

Dr. Malik is scientist author advisor educator and chairman of the management centers and Gallants Whitson under the Mallik Institute for complexity, management, governments, governance and leadership. Friedman has written a number of books and, to be honest, this is one of those occasions where I can say I have read a number of those books and we ourselves here at pipeliner, followed the thematic management theory and find it it has transformed the way we Do business so it’s excited to to talk to you today.

So what I wanted to talk about is this concept of integration or superest integration and, first of all, maybe for everybody here. Maybe if you can just define or explain what’s integration is, did you say to make something clear? You did really read the book, so you didn’t. Oh, I did yes, yes like no. I did. I read the books. In fact, you know we. We we followed the. We follow the management theory here at that pipeliner, okay, okay, well, this integration is an artificial.

It’s a creation of words. Combining two words name is synergy and integration, so sin a duration and what it actually means is bringing together quite a number, a big number, a large number of people to join in in a highly harmonious symphonie, one could always almost say in order to interconnect our Knowledge is from very many fields, creating something as a rule, totally new to a leading question, which is important, has been selected by the board or whatever Authority in their organizations to be of utmost importance.

So so this concept, I think, becomes even more exciting when you think about that organizations are, are no longer they’re, no longer restricted or homogeneous or even one-dimensional, because they can now have a mixture of like full-time employees, part-timers contractors, some office space, some remote spread around The world, so this idea of bringing all these skill sets together. It’s almost like it’s time has arrived, because now you don’t have the restrictions on getting to the expertise you need.

Yes, that is true, and it depends of course or it is. It follows from the technological breakthroughs we have done in the last couple of decades by the use of cybernetics of computer technology, of more than information and communication technology which follow from these Sciences. And so, at the first time in, let me say in the practice of management actually, which is very old one actually, because people have all always had to manage their the destination their daily life.

But for the first time we are acute with totally different technologies. We have not so far, at least broadly speaking, followed up with the organizational setups which is needed, so you have painted a very, very colored and good picture of all those combinations of things which we’re quite a couple of years, unthinkable, mm-hmm and – and it’s it’s funny – That you should say that about the organization’s not catching up, because it’s it’s quite ironic, and I and I find this all the time.

Is you see openes who have disruptive or innovative business models or products or services and they’re highly creative, innovative companies, but when they make the breakthrough, they then create very, very traditional, hierarchical companies. They bring people together and they build offices and they adopt extremely traditional models, which seems almost at odds with their disruptive. You know business models or breakthrough technologies, so so how do companies start to catch up? Because that’s at that obviously is going to impact at some stage the way you operate.

In our case I mean practically all of these, or most of these startup companies start with technology, some sort of digitalization, of course, that’s very understandable. These are the young people who are becoming very familiar in their university years or whatever, even as amateurs, but we did it the other way around just by accident. Basically, we started with the organizational said no wanted to know.

How would organizations look like if we, if we looked at them or try to understand them as living organisms? For it is a metaphor, a picture which will help many so interconnected systems, organizationally people and all the departments and whatever we have? And this is an offspring of cybernetics too. So I would like tend to mention just a little bit fact that my kind of management is a twin brother to digitalization yeah and and, as I said, I mean we follow your management theories here and found them to be extremely effective in in how it helps Us operate as an organization, so how much does this change this access to talent across the globe and in in different mode? As I said, you can have full-time employee contract.

You can scale your business now with a lot of variable resources, because you’ve accent access to them. That’s going to change the balance of power somewhat because in in past times it’s like you have companies, maybe you have like Silicon Valley and it’s all concentrated there and that’s where people need to be and that’s the balance. But now we have the potential for some kind of sort of global democratization of resources right absolutely, and it’s done that it’s worldwide possible.

Basically, let us build a way for a moment political fact: difficulties between different countries, China, the u.S. Etcetera cetera. There are still some career, but even they become very, very they become penetrated by technology, basically and by what technology transports and interconnects these days, namely intelligence by the way of information and communication in totally new formats, yeah and obviously, with the digital.

With the with the spread of broadband and now the promise of 5g, the the ability for people, as you say, across the globe, to be able to contribute to the to to the digital world, is going to grow exponentially right absolutely and what grows the fastest is Complexity, so let me let me point to the fact that for the first time in history, due to technology, I mean what I should say first is that it is not digitalization or digitization.

However, one pronounces it particularly in your country, it is not really new. We have the idol the last analog computer in the 1970s or so so that’s not really new, and we had already a big big company by the name of digital equipment. You might remember, and his very very famous founder canossian. The thing is, or the point is, what does digitization really allow us to do, and this is for the first time in history we can interconnect everything to everything else globally and this will be sort of an Omega state.

So to speak – and this is the power which is already working in nature, but in evolution by bringing up totally new things, creativity, amplification of intelligence, combining it the connecting everything with everything else, basically, globally. It will last a few years until we achieve that state really. But the technology is there and examples of this means that I mean the driving forces. You interrupt me please, no, no go on do not go head to head.

The driving forces are, of course, these technologies, but it’s not only the computer side. It’s only the biologic. It’s also the biological ones, so the bio science has become very, very important with the help of the computers, and this is one driving force. Another one is the demography I mean in. We have a lot of demographic issues and challenges. Another one is ecology, of course, and the ecosystems become all the more important and then we have also the indebtedness, the economic situation at now, but the strongest right, the most powerful driver is, in my opinion, complexity.

What comes out, interconnectivity is what we call complexity and many people shy away from it and they want to reduce complexity. On the other hand, some some things have to be reduced, probably, and in some instances it is okay. So, but on the other hand, our brains are the most complex apparatus, so to speak organs there are some ten hundred billions. It’s hundred billions of of nerve cells are interconnected in so and so many trillions of time, and this is the basis of our intelligence and our knowledge and even our emotions mm-hm.

And it’s interesting that you talk about the complexity, because, obviously yes, when you get this global democratization, etc, then it it does become more complex to manage all of this. But at the same time you have mentioned cybernetics a couple of times, and you said you know about complexity, so we we also adopt cybernetic principles in our in our products. So how does cybernetics play into this whole scenario? Cybernetics is what whole systems together.

So it is the capacity of self-organization it brings in the capacity to self regulating system to amplification of intelligence, for instance by again interconnecting parts of knowledge. Knowledge — is which are apart so far, but if we interconnect them – and there is a huge outbreak of creativity, for instance, amplification of of intelligence – I already mentioned unfreezing of knowledge, which is otherwise stuck in these silos of the conventional organization, and this gives us an Enormous amount of freedom, also in the emotional sphere.

Basically, because, with the very methodology of cinta Gration, which you meant of our conversation, we can set free the emotions of people in a way which was never even before yeah and so and so getting back to what we’re also talking about. So this raises huge challenges. Then for organizations and how to restructure themselves to be able to take advantage of all of this and, as I said earlier, even the most innovative companies tend to default to very traditional modes of operating and and and the structure and organization.

So now organizations are going to have to become more creative in how they organize themselves correct, exactly they become brain-like, and we actually and explicitly are using together with this integrational and methodologies the model of viable systems as we call it, and this is a model actually Of the human nervous system, which belongs to the most complex, but to very build functioning systems – and this is our hour – let me say our model – we are following because it works so well and we are all familiar with it or at least partly so, and so We are building organizations after that particular model and using cinta Gration as a radical, but then there are totally new kinds of strategy, for instance – and you mentioned the word – the concept of effectiveness at the very beginning.

We are after what we call a culture of effectiveness. So cultures may have many many different formats and one needs several of them, of course, but one thing is how to make all these things effective if in the rising complexity of the various parts of the world – and this is still or has been so far, an Unsolved problem, but we are very close to it. Yes, because, as I said, you know having read your books and and adopted your management and theories, you know focus on the results and effectiveness, and your obviously key to that – and I do feel sometimes you see and there’s a danger here as well as with these Organizations Asians, that the the journey becomes the focuses of pose to the outcome.

Yes, you are very that’s a very good big picture. You are you’re painting, so with the tools and, of course, sciences we are using. We can speed up the working of organizations by. Thank you pocket a factor of 60 to 100, not just six percent or ten percent, which would already be a lot of, but a factor of time, sixty two hundred creating the strong will by people to really change her make use of all these things unfreezing the Emotions and, by the way, the good as opposed to the bad emotions that are there and in many organizations I would say almost in almost all of them.

Quite the problematic emotions are predominating instead of the other ones. Creating a strong will to change your set already. So by using these methods, these social technologies strongly based on the server netic principles, and so but so when you talk to organizations and you do a lot of work with big organizations and what are some of the obstacles or or the resistance you see to this Kind of breakthrough thinking I mean there are quite a number of persons who just cannot imagine.

It is strange. It is like science fiction’s and things like that, and in a way, yes up until, let me say three, four or five years ago or ten make it ten years ago, it was already one could dream about it, and now it is at least becoming reality, and We have already applied that for almost 1,000 times and it never failed and not only that, but it performed so excellently that the satisfaction rankings are between 90 and 100 on a scale of 100 and this astonishes people and in particular also those.

Ladies and gentlemen, in the top ranks because they are suffering from the organizational obstacles to there are so many highly talented persons up there. But then how can they really master and move, let me say accompanied with 400,000 people or make it 40,000. Even that is a very complex organization, and and and and obviously you know, that’s that’s why the temptation then just to put in hierarchies and put in lots and lots of layers of middle management comes in, but that model doesn’t really work when you’re bringing like which It’s integration when you’re bringing talent together for projects or to solve problems or whatever those models start to break down yeah, so it is, and partly we can compare it.

Let me say to a symphony: orchestra know whom of our listeners love for classical music, but on the other hand, if they love jazz, for instance, it is about the same thing. No people can harmoniously work together play together. There is a yes, there is a melody on that basic, but then you can improvise around it and it always comes together to give something better, which is more than just the sum of its parts and symphony some may like better classical music.

Then they can imagine what it actually means, but then we go very much beyond the number of people who constitute the Symphony Orchestra. We can amplify that we can proliferate that kind of interplay and then to change yeah. So it’s it definitely has I mean the division. I think for anyone listening, I mean it. It’s a very exciting one, as I said where you can bring together. All of these different skill sets and creative minds and problem-solve and bring them all together and source them to solve problems and and to you know, achieve the results that you’re looking for.

But, as we said, it raises some challenges for people who have very traditional ways of thinking when it comes to to organizational culture. So what would you in in in the last few minutes here? What are some of the things? How would you advise organizations to start this process or to truly start examining whether they should be looking at an evolution of how they operate? There are very, there are several points to start with.

One is, for instance, to consider just as if it just to compare the organization with a living organism. I do not say that organizations as we have them are living organisms, but anyway they are populated by living organisms. So there is at least for now, and there is a certain comparability. Let me put it like that and then, if we let our ideas flow and say let us assume our company could be a living organism.

What should we have to do? I do not say that organizations already are like living organisms, but we can. We can think about that see and then there come up a lot of creative ideas to stop it. That is one thing another one. If one expands on that idea, you come to the ecosystem, so the word ecosystem become. These are the natural, interconnected kinds of populations plants animals whatever. So this is another good picture which is very attractive to quite a number of persons, another one we have already.

Basically, some of these cybernetic organizations so, for instance, the regulation of the international air traffic air traffic control. We have some 200,000 flights every day Dayton around the globe in every weather, condition and practically nothing happens. So there are already some such instances and examples which one can study and then it flows quite by itself see so the fantasy of people is already stimulated and ignited and they like these kinds of ideas and in particular all of them see, but enough of them On the highest ranks because they see they, they get an idea of how to unleash the potential, which is, let me say, below them, in the organizational excellence which are badly badly needed, and they know that they are yeah and and and beyond.

The organization. As we said now, with the access to all of these resources across the globe that can be brought in where you can bring in specialists for a time, you know in a way that you never could before well live. If this in the Friedmann, this has been a, this has been a fascinating conversation, and I think we could go on for a lot longer we’re scratching the surface, but want to do. I wanted to thank you for your time today.

I also wanted to thank you for for your work. As I said, we have adopted us here and it’s made. It’s made a big difference to us, so I would really encourage people who are reading or listening to go and check out. Professor Malik’s work. His management theories and his other books, because there I think you’re going to find that they’re quite transfer transformative. So again, I just wanted to thank you for your time today.

Thank you very much. John was a pleasure to talk to you. Thank you for your wonderful questions and their stimulating conversation. My name is John golden says. Pop online sales magazine pipeliner CRM, CEO for another expert interview really soon. Thank you.

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Consistency in Sales with Weldon Long | Sales Expert Insights Series

Post author By Jimmy Dagger
Post date May 22, 2020
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How you doing! Welcome yeah, I’m doing great man thanks for out thanks for skyping, looking forward to this yeah and for those of you who may not know Weldon, he is and a lot of you already do. He is a New York Times best seller with the power of consistency. He’s an entrepreneur sales expert: he has driven fortune 5 fortune 5 size and companies to unbelievable heights in revenue generation.

So Weldon really looks really knows what he’s talking about, and what I wanted to ask Weldon about today was about his book, the power of consistency and – and why is consistency so important for sales number one and second? Why is it something that perhaps we overlooked a lot at the time? Yeah, that’s a great question. You know, I think the the benefit of consistency is very simple. We all know that consistent sales activities produce consistent sales results, random sales activities, random sales results right.

It’s not rocket science, if you think about the operations and manufacturing side of business, let’s think of a computer chip manufacturer if they used on a random process and their engineering and their development and the manufacturing of their chips, they just kind of walked in the factory. Each day – and sometimes they do this – and sometimes they do that – we all know that the quality of the computer chip would be really really bad without a lot of unhappy customers.

So we understand instinctively from a manufacturing operations perspective that we have to have a process. Unfortunately, when it comes to sales, we don’t apply that same level of the need for consistency. We oftentimes think that we could just kind of show up on a sales call, and just you know, rely on our wits and our communication skills. The problem is, if we don’t have a consistent sales process, we’re not going to have consistent sales results.

In other words, when you look at a sales process, kind of the basic four components build a relationship investigate the problem solve the problem. Ask for the order, if we’re random in that process, then we’re going to get the same kind of results that the manufacturing facility would get if they had a random manufacturing process. We’re going to have very inconsistent sales results. So when I talk to salespeople, you know it’s like if, if your process are your results, rather, if your results are sometimes good and sometimes bad and sometimes good, and some that is by definition, random results yeah those random results are not coming from consistent sales.

I totally agree with you, so why is it then that in some areas of sales there has been this resistance to the idea of process or consistency, and some people will hide that behind the you know, it’s a kind of an art, and I do it my Way and they do it their way, and I just you know I don’t want to interfere with it and processes for other people, it’s not for us. Well, I think that it’s a great question, John, listen salespeople.

We tend to be a little bit more on the creative side versus you know the the organized side right, it’s kind of what makes us good. We have great communication skills, we can schmooze, we can kiss hands, we can shake babies or whatever that thing do all that stuff, and we kind of look at you know a sales process as being put in a straitjacket right so exhibiting used to often say that If you don’t have a sales process, in other words, if you don’t have a process you have to have when he call they can the presentation to be successful in sales.

Now, if it sounds like a can presentation, you’re going to be toast right, but you have to have a process. I think we resist it. There’s two reasons number one. I think we see ourselves as more creative communicators and we don’t like the restrictions. The kind of the process kind of puts on us and we got to be in a straitjacket, but I think the other thing is – and this is a big part of my book, both in our consistency and my new book consistency selling.

The bottom line is that we all face challenges in life and those challenges come down to three types: money, problems, relationship problems and health problems and the key to success in sales. The key to success in life. He is learning how to prosper in the face of those challenges right. It’s not that successful people somehow avoid money problems or avoid relationship problems or avoid health problems.

Is that they’re very good at dealing with those things and what happens off times? Is that we’re going out or making a sales call, and we have some personal problem or some financial problem, and it distracts us, and so we just kind of wing it this. The the key to success is learning how to prosper in all areas of our life. In the face of those challenges, that’s what I really talk about in both of those books.

You know how do you, how do you thrive and prosper in the face versus my life is? My life has been a textbook example of diversity. I spent 25 years of my life on the streets. I spent 13 years in prison when I was thirty years old, I was living in a homeless shelter, so I know all about adversity. What I’ve learned is that, if you can learn to deal with that adversity and prosper in the face of that, that’s where success comes in in terms of the process, consistency has kind of two folds and we can talk about these in detail number one.

Is the sales person sales professional doing the same things over and over? The second component of consistency is from the consistency theory right. So if I tell you as a customer, if I tell you that price is not the most important factor in my decision mmm-hmm and the hour later, I start you know complaining about the price right yeah. Those are inconsistent statements and the key is to hold prospects accountable to their previous declarations.

So and it’s interesting thing about the adversity piece right, because sales is all about adversity right because I mean it’s the one, it’s the one, it’s the one job where know is for you here know more than anything else right. So what is the key to learning? How to face up to adversity rather than outsource it? If you like or just say, oh well, there’s nothing I could do you know the reality is every time we come into a sales opportunity, there’s going to be difficulties right, there’s going to be obstacles, we’re going to have customers who want a cheaper price, we’re going To have customers who want to think about it, we’re going to have customers who want to talk to our competition.

The key in sales, just like in life, is learning how to thrive in the face of those obstacles. The key to that is to have proactive discussions with our prospects, proactive discussions. So, for example, let’s say I was selling you a new car, then before I start talking to you about selling the new car, I’m going to ask you a simple question: I’m going to say John again in the course of buying a new car, I’m sure that Price is going to be something that you consider.

What’s going to be one of the things, that’s you evaluate correct, mm-hmm. Well, you know I’d like to share with you an article from edmunds.Com that talks about the ten most important factors that we should consider when buying a new car and, as you can see here, price is number six. You know the reputation, the service department, the the appropriate, the type of car for your needs, and all these are the factors.

So let me ask you John: would you agree or disagree with with edmunds.Com that there are a few factors that are as important, perhaps even more for than the chief price yeah? So if I get you to make that concession upfront now I now already I’m trying to sell you a car and I’m going to ask you to sign the paperwork on a car, and I want you to raise the price objection. So John misses the car. I’m going to recommend this is a perfect car for you and your family based on.

I think I’m worried about you and the time we spend together. So the only question I have is that when you trust me with this recommendation for a car, I’m still a bit, it’s still a bit off on the price. No, it’s a big decision! John! I don’t say that completely, but you know earlier you had mentioned that you agree with Consumer Reports. That price was not the most important factor in your decision as that changed our time together.

No, no! No, no you come to mention it. It hasn’t really well great. With the information I’d like to start the paperwork: well, the key there is public declarations dictate future actions and it’s based on a psychological principle of cognitive dissonance, and I looked at on my read. It is three o’clock and I forgotten, like oh, I forgot to pick up John, that anxiety is called distance when humans feel dissonance.

We want to get rid of it. So what do I do? I picked the phone up and I said John I’m going to be late. I’m sorry I’ll be there, but I do something to get back into a state of residence, so I can feel better about Who I am as a person. The same rules apply in sales. If I can get, you acknowledged, price is not the most important factor and then you bring it up later. I simply remind you, it’s conversation, you’re doing with spirits, dissonance right, because you did say that an hour ago and you’re going to feel anxiety well as the Sales Professional.

I’m simply going to ask you for the order again, which is metaphorically throwing your life preserver. So you can make a decision, that’s consistent with your previous actions right. It’s not the rocket science right using psychological principles and the sales principles to achieve the results that we want every day, and what I like about that Weldon is the fact that you’d you, as you said I mean you, didn’t sit around as a lot of you Know a lot of people when they’re in a selling situation, they’re dreading the obstacle coming up: they’re dreading the objection coming up.

You are like, okay, I’m going to just meet it head-on, I’m going to deal with it early and and then I’m going to have a fallback position later, if it, if it rears its ugly head again, but what I’m not going to do is avoid it right. You know people operate on the misconception that that effective sales – it’s about high-pressure effective sales, is not about high-pressure effective sales. Jon is about high service, not willing to extend ourselves professionally emotionally to our customers.

Part of that extension is that I have to you, know kind of have some insight and what I know what the objections are going to be if you’re selling your CRM, for example, that your company produces it sells whatever you know what the objections are every time That you’re going to sell it, there’s probably two or three or four that you’re going to face on 80 % of your calls. We should never be caught flatly.

We should never be caught right unaware. We have to anticipate those and, as you said, not dread. Those coming up but anticipate those coming up and approach them with like I knew this was coming. I know what you’re thinking before what you’re thinking, because I sell you, know software ten times a day, you buy it once every 10 years. I should know more about what the objections are going to be the new day, so it does not anticipate an answer about the hard work of sales, and that is what consistency comes in.

I know exactly what I’m going to say, depending on what objections, and I anticipate that you’re going to it’s. I think one of the other pieces about consistency well done. A few agree is that there’s there’s nothing worse than if you have an experience with the salesperson and then maybe you get to sale. Maybe you submit the car or whatever – and this has happened to me personally and then I call you up a week later because there’s an issue with it and you’re completely different person right so I mean how how important is it to because I always say like Chameleons make great pets and they’re lovely to look at and everything but salespeople they can be, it can be devastating right, listen, and this is part of the extending ourselves emotionally and professionally you’re, not just my customer before you sign on the line that is not a Year out of the homeless shelter, I started heating, an air conditioned company.

Now I don’t a first thing about heating and air conditioning, but I know how to sell so. I started this company and I focused on the marketing and sales. I hired the operations people by the way through that company. The 20 million dollars in revenue in five years in 2009 were selected is one of the magazine’s fastest growing companies, but the core foundation of that company is, I offered what I call the one year test drive right, so John again will roleplay and say you’re, my Customer you’re, my homeowner, I say John – have you ever bought something from a department store.

You didn’t like he’s a flashlight or something like that sure, and you decided you wanted to return that item. What happened when you went back to the store? Did they did? They shun you did they turn you out the door or they give your money back or any pot. Whatever you want yeah. No, there was a pretty simple process exactly well. I decided it should be the same way: the heating air conditioning industry so John.

What I’m going to do is to extend this offer. You’re, a one-year test drive I’m going to put in a brand new heating and air conditioning system, and I don’t want you to buy it tonight. I want you to try it for a year 11 months in 29 days at the end of that process. Any time during that first year, if you decide the system doesn’t work properly, you don’t get proper service. You don’t like to waste.

Someone from my company treated you on the phone. I will offer you the opportunity with one phone call to me: no brain damage. I will remove that system and refund 100 % of your initial investment. Now John. What does that say about the level of quality and service? I’m going to offer you if I have that kind of responsibility on my shoulders? Well, I mean obviously you’re going to you’re going to turn over every stone to make sure that you’re the best quality of service in all areas and every interaction the customer has with your business right exactly so John now, if you call me a month later, two Months over the problem, I have a responsibility and obligation.

I got to make sure you’re happy. I can’t that chameleon. Also I’m like who are you what’s they’ve done, I’ve got to make sure that you are taken care of, because I have a responsibility. You know that I have to extend to you, so did you ever actually have to take your system out? That’s a wonderful question. In the best question. The reality is in 20 dollars of sales. In five years. I never had to return a system.

I will tell you: there were a few opportunities where I did it, because I wanted to sure I remember. For example, we had a customer. Her name was Sarah Parker. We installed a very expensive system to her high-efficiency system and on eight months later, she calls me up and she wanted us to come and install a less expensive system and refund her the difference when I I said well, what’s wrong with the system, she said, nothing’s Wrong with the system, when I’ve been diagnosed with cancer and I’m having to leave my job for treatment, I got to sell my house I’m trying to get all my money together.

When I understood what happened the situation she was in, I said Sarah, you keep the system and let me refund the difference, and so I didn’t have to, but I did it by the way. The letter that I got from Sarah Parker, in my estimation, was worth 20 million dollars, because that letter was the foundation of my sales process. We have to sell with integrity, we have to deliver service with integrity. One of my mentors was Steven Covey, who wrote the seven Habits of Highly Effective People, and I learned something, as I often say, values are knowing what to do.

Characters having the strength to do it and integrity is doing it when the push comes to shove. Right in the rubber meets the road you have to be a by the way, I would tell all of our business owners sales professionals out there that the way I looked at that kind of return of money as marketing money, because it was the best marketing money. I could ever spend because my next 10 customers next 100 customers.

They were going to hear about that story and never going to read that letter with me. I promise you so I mean so as you guys as you’ve outlined beautifully here. There is a huge economic value to consistency right to the consistency of whether you’re just an individual sales person or an organization, but take it down to the level of a sales person right if you, if you provide a consistent level of service and really well.

If I do that to you right, then you’re likely to recommend me, but I have to deliver that to every single person who recommends me right. I have to deliver it to the next person. The next person, the next person, absolutely is really important. Listen people all communicate in different ways. Some people will read and learn. Some people read articles. Some people hear some people are tactile learners like they learn by touching things.

Some people learn through emotion and stories. So when I create a sales presentation form, is I incorporate every form of communication in the sales presentation? The reason I do that is, I don’t know for sure what a particular customer I don’t know how they’re going to connect with me. Are they connected to the story? Are they connecting to the product demonstration? Are they connecting to what they’re, seeing or reading you never know for sure, so we incorporate all of these forms of communication to a prospect.

If I have consistency – and I do my sales process the same way every time I’m going to hit every one of those communication medium right, so I’m going to connect with you at some point. If I start picking and choosing which part of the presentation I’m going to use, I may skip the form of communication that would have run you over right, say you can’t be random in this process. You have to hit every form of communication with your prospects.

They have to see pictures, they have to hear stories, they have to touch products and experience products. They have to get emotional, they have to have logic. They have to have all these various things, because I’m going to connect with you on one of those. If I start reading – and we decided I’m going to try this I’m going to try that I might miss the one thing that we run you over as a customer, so at the essence of what you’re a lot of the essence of what you’re talking about here Is obviously, you know consistency of execution, but it’s preparation and planning to write, because you can’t be considered.

You can’t do what you just said about having a presentation that hits all the different you know: learning styles or whatever information receiving styles, unless you’ve done your homework here, my desk. This is for a 50 million dollar company in California, and I developed their presentation book and their job is to go to this book. Tell the stories I teach them to tell ask the questions. I teach them to ask and, throughout the course of these 10 or 15 pages, we’re going to touch on every one of those communication methods right, I’m going to connect with somebody at some point.

I do the same thing with FedEx. I do the same thing, but Farmers Insurance. I do the same thing with Wells Fargo. You got to communicate and do it the same way every single time, if you, if you manufacture computer chips and you do it randomly you’re, going to have really poor quality result, and what about with you know when a a prospect or whatever starts to take you Off track and you’ve started starting to feel like.

Oh I’m, never going to get to these pieces or I’m going to miss something and the I’m. Obviously I’m trying to be accommodating here and go down this. You know rabbit hole with them. How do you? How do you advise as people to control that situation as best they can given the fact that you have to react to the customer? Great great great question number number one. I rely on the process because I’ll follow the process and let’s say I’m on page five of my process.

Now again you can’t sound like a possum. It can’t sound like an presentation but less than the phone rings and the prospect gets distracted with some other issue. In their business or if I’m in home sales, one of the kids comes around crying for mommy right. When the dust settles on that distraction, I can bring them right back where I was right. So I stay on the past. The other issue you mentioned the rabbit holes.

This is a really important issue. I’m glad you brought it up. You don’t have to chase every rabbit down every hole a lot of times with people, especially when you use a consistency theory to sell. When I reminded you, for example earlier that you said, price led the most important common things that home what other prospects will do, is they feel that nervous energy because hey, I did say that an hour ago and they’ll start going down rabbit holes? Oh well, I got ta go on vacation next week to my brother-in-law.

I got ta talk to him and my kids, down to the doctor and they’ll come up with every distraction. All you have to do is to when they finish speaking acknowledge. Yes, I understand it’s important to get your child to the doctor. I important I understand it’s important to go, see your brother-in-law. However, with your permission, what do you say? We start the paperwork, and so I ignore the distractions, because when people get nervous, it’s a very common human behavior, we get nervous.

I ramble mm-hm and people will do that. The problem is a Sales Professional, sometimes those ramblings which are just on nervous energy. We start taking those as legitimate objections and we start next thing. You know what do you feel about the vacation, these rabbit holes like you’re, talking about and next thing you know we’re having a different conversation. Do you have to stay on Rails, especially? We gets the closing sequence right because that’s the most common time, people will try to distract you and get you off.

You got ta be on Rails. You don’t know exactly what you’re going to say during your closing sequence and you have to stay focused. Whatever obstacles come up, you simply remind them of what they said earlier and come back and ask the order yeah, and that is about preparation, as you mentioned. If I go back to Stephen Covey, the four quadrants of time, quadrant two is planning preparation and prevention.

We have to take the time to practice. Roleplay prepare ourselves. So when those objections come up, we’re on Rails right, we don’t get distracted because we’re the professionals we sell. Whatever we sell every single day, your customer probably buys it once every few years, lady once on a lifetime right – and I think that’s it – that’s an important thing to add there is that idea of when you do get down to the end of the process and As you say, maybe I only buy it once or a year or twice.

Oh maybe this is maybe it’s in a b2b. Maybe this is the first time the company is trusted me to make a big purchase and there’s a lot of emotion attached. There’s a lot on my back, you know, and so I’m bound to get nervous towards the end, I’m bound to start thinking. Am I making the right decision so if you can anticipate all that and, as you say, not get caught up in my anxiety but rather make me feel better than obviously there’s a greater chance of closing the deal, this is the bottom line.

Is everybody gets nervous at the end sales professional gets nervous, we’re talking about money. The prospect gets nervous because we’re talking about money, the reality is, it causes us emotional pain. We spend money, there’s a lot of scientific research about that that we spend money. It causes the emotional pain centers our brain, to become very active, the same way as if our dog dies. It’s an emotional experience, so we have to make sure that we are staying focused so that we don’t get distracted by these things.

At the end of the day, I tell people listen in sales, you have to be friendly, but not every prospect or customer. Is your friend hmm at some point you have to be the professional at some point you have to be the physician who delivers. You know the news you have to have the surgery. We have to do this, it’s in your best interest and we have to be willing to kind of you know what I, when I tell people it’s a that sounds a little corny.

I guess, but you have to be willing to jeopardize the relationship. Some salespeople are so good, the relationship they never move into closing because they don’t want to seem like the salesperson. You have to be both. You have to have the relationship and then you have to courage the conviction, the commitment to ask for the order and to hold this person accountable to the process right. It’s not always fun to do, but listen.

You know Zig Ziglar used to say if you can’t close you’re going to have skinny kids, here’s the bottom line at the end, that’s what I teach salespeople whenever I talk to them when you’re at when you have that moment where you know you need to ask For the order, but you’re afraid that they’re going to be offended, are you afraid they’re going to somehow be disappointed because all the sudden, your sales professional, think about this think about who’s going to be disappointed? If you don’t ask for the order you know who it is, is your family and the people who count on you to bring home the bacon right to bring home the money to pay the bills to provide a quality of life? Am I going to disappoint them by being afraid to ask for the order, or am I going to risk? Maybe just maybe this prospect thinks I’m awesome a salesperson.

If I got to disappoint somebody, I’m not going to disappoint my wife and kids. I’m never going to come home to my wife and kids and say: hey guys. We can’t go to Disneyland, we can’t go to private school. We can’t do this, the kid that, because I’m too big of a candy-ass never going to happen yeah and by the way I always say to people when this comes up. Is I hate to break the news to you, but they know you’re a salesperson going on exactly listen Weldon.

This has been fantastic, so just before we go, can you tell the people when the new book is coming out and a little bit more about you yeah? So consistency selling comes out October, 2nd it’s available for presale, go to Grover long com. There’s an offer. We have you. Click on. You buy the book through Amazon. You put your order back in and I said that we said like an hour’s worth of article training on the mindset in the sales process.

It’s super super powerful content and we’re just time to promote the new book so dirty water, long, calm and you’ll see it or go to consistency. Selling, calm and you’ll see the awesome grades. Listen. This has been fantastic wealth and my name is John golden says. Pop online says magazine pipeliner CRM SEO for another expert insight interview really soon. Thank you. So I encourage you to subscribe to sales popped on net.

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